On BBC Radio 4 26th April The Investigation dealt with whether Organic food is better for you and also various other assertions about it. Local Grown and imported organic food were also dealt with. You can hear it on Listen Again for the next 6 days only.
If only there were a text version.
Allan
is Organic food better
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Cider Boys
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Hello Allan
What heading is the programme under?
I can not seem to find it - unless the namby pamby arty fa*ty pinkos that run the BBC have removed it!!!
Best wishes
Barney
What heading is the programme under?
I can not seem to find it - unless the namby pamby arty fa*ty pinkos that run the BBC have removed it!!!
Best wishes
Barney
Hi Barney,
I know that this an awfully long website but this should take you to the programme.
It is well worth listening to.
We should discuss when you have listened.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/mainframe.shtml?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/radio4_a ... adio4/fttw.
Thank you Allan for pointing it out.
Trust the BBC to schedule a programme like that when I was indisposed!
JB.
I know that this an awfully long website but this should take you to the programme.
It is well worth listening to.
We should discuss when you have listened.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/mainframe.shtml?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/radio4_a ... adio4/fttw.
Thank you Allan for pointing it out.
Trust the BBC to schedule a programme like that when I was indisposed!
JB.
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alan refail
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Cider Boys wrote:Hello Allan
What heading is the programme under?
I can not seem to find it - unless the namby pamby arty fa*ty pinkos that run the BBC have removed it!!!
Best wishes
Barney
Looks like a case of "Here we go again"
Barney, I'm surprised you listen to the BBC at all. You've certainly put me off listening.
Alan
Cred air o bob deg a glywi, a thi a gei rywfaint bach o wir (hen ddihareb Gymraeg)
Believe one tenth of what you hear, and you will get some little truth (old Welsh proverb)
Believe one tenth of what you hear, and you will get some little truth (old Welsh proverb)
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Cider Boys
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Hello Alan
I’m an avid listener to Radio4 and have been for decades, especially the Today programme. I was selected and I am a proud member of the Today programme listener panel (God help them). I have a few thoughts and views that I regularly share with the producer.
In fact, it may surprise you, but I have an opinion on most things! And if I could get the links that Johnboy kindly gave me to work I surely would have some more thoughts to share with you all. However when I click on the lower link all I get is some female telling me that the item is not available, I can feel the need for yet another letter to Radio4 to give them some of my impartial advice.
Still struggling with modern technology, all the best
Barney
I’m an avid listener to Radio4 and have been for decades, especially the Today programme. I was selected and I am a proud member of the Today programme listener panel (God help them). I have a few thoughts and views that I regularly share with the producer.
In fact, it may surprise you, but I have an opinion on most things! And if I could get the links that Johnboy kindly gave me to work I surely would have some more thoughts to share with you all. However when I click on the lower link all I get is some female telling me that the item is not available, I can feel the need for yet another letter to Radio4 to give them some of my impartial advice.
Still struggling with modern technology, all the best
Barney
Program is called 'The Investigation'
the link JB gave is one link not 2 as shown - run them together
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/mainfram ... adio4/fttw.
Enjoy
Mole
the link JB gave is one link not 2 as shown - run them together
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/mainfram ... adio4/fttw.
Enjoy
Mole
Last edited by Mole on Sat Apr 28, 2007 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Doctor Deb
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I also listened to this with interest.I think I have fallen for the "organic must be better" arguements for some time.A more judicious approach might be to grow as organically as possible, and buy as locally as possible, but to recognise that the health benefits are at best unproven, and that over zealous adherence to organic and local can be detrimental to the health and economic susrvival of the most vulnerable people of the world. The environmental benefits of growing organically still seem persuasive, however, and worth aiming for.
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Cider Boys
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Hello Mole
Thanks for the help but unfortunately this young lady keeps telling me she is sorry and can not bring me the feature I requested. (The story of my life).
I’m not one to give up lightly, feint heart and all that, I will prevail and hear this programme. However any further help would be much appreciated.
Best wishes
Barney
Thanks for the help but unfortunately this young lady keeps telling me she is sorry and can not bring me the feature I requested. (The story of my life).
I’m not one to give up lightly, feint heart and all that, I will prevail and hear this programme. However any further help would be much appreciated.
Best wishes
Barney
Hi Barney,
Try this website which is the Radio 4 list of programmes it is listed as Investigation, The.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/atoz/index.shtml#f
In my previous posting I do not know how the two lines got separated as they were posted as one but I failed to notice it.
I find the BBC Websites the most infuriating of all.
They cannot do something simply they always
have to go round the houses!
JB.
Try this website which is the Radio 4 list of programmes it is listed as Investigation, The.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/atoz/index.shtml#f
In my previous posting I do not know how the two lines got separated as they were posted as one but I failed to notice it.
I find the BBC Websites the most infuriating of all.
They cannot do something simply they always
have to go round the houses!
JB.
There are several ways of getting to programmes on the BBC website. I keep the radio player on my favourites list in a radio/TV file, it also serves for farming today and GQT
You could also get there by going to
www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/theinvestigation
where there is a link to all the series,
or alternatively by direct link
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/theinvestigation/pip/pn2aw/
and I note that the two most recent programmes can be listened to, maybe tis is because they are a new series. The previous one is about soeed cameras.
Allan
You could also get there by going to
www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/theinvestigation
where there is a link to all the series,
or alternatively by direct link
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/theinvestigation/pip/pn2aw/
and I note that the two most recent programmes can be listened to, maybe tis is because they are a new series. The previous one is about soeed cameras.
Allan
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Cider Boys
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Hello Allan, Johnboy & all
Thanks for the help, I have managed to listen to this very interesting item.
Nothing new though is it? We three have tried to argue many of these findings for some time now. The organic zealots are quick to contradict our misgivings but were peddling myths rather than science and are now being found out. There are many good reasons to grow food in an organic way for example adding manures and compost to soils improves their structures as well as supplying nutrients, but to then take the argument that organic food is better is an inappropriate claim. The SA must take some responsibility for the assumption of many of the general public that unless it is organic it is full of nasty chemicals etc.. It has stood by when many of their members have brazenly published these false mantras. Unfortunately the benefits of growing food using organic methods such as those practised by Lawrence D Hills and W E Shewell-Cooper have been lost by the new organic lobby who just promote the name for profit. They are indeed in danger of ending up with the general public regarding organic food as synonymous with over priced food, which of course it is. Still, I’m proud to be picking and eating my broad beans in late April that I have grown with only the aid of FYM and try to grow using the methods of Hills and Shewell-Cooper but as Johnboy describes it, in a pragmatic way.
It will be interesting to read the contributions of some of our younger organic members and their take on the programme. I just hope they have less trouble than me in finding it!
Truth and justice will prevail.
Barney
Thanks for the help, I have managed to listen to this very interesting item.
Nothing new though is it? We three have tried to argue many of these findings for some time now. The organic zealots are quick to contradict our misgivings but were peddling myths rather than science and are now being found out. There are many good reasons to grow food in an organic way for example adding manures and compost to soils improves their structures as well as supplying nutrients, but to then take the argument that organic food is better is an inappropriate claim. The SA must take some responsibility for the assumption of many of the general public that unless it is organic it is full of nasty chemicals etc.. It has stood by when many of their members have brazenly published these false mantras. Unfortunately the benefits of growing food using organic methods such as those practised by Lawrence D Hills and W E Shewell-Cooper have been lost by the new organic lobby who just promote the name for profit. They are indeed in danger of ending up with the general public regarding organic food as synonymous with over priced food, which of course it is. Still, I’m proud to be picking and eating my broad beans in late April that I have grown with only the aid of FYM and try to grow using the methods of Hills and Shewell-Cooper but as Johnboy describes it, in a pragmatic way.
It will be interesting to read the contributions of some of our younger organic members and their take on the programme. I just hope they have less trouble than me in finding it!
Truth and justice will prevail.
Barney
Hi Barney,
Generally I have no real quarrel with organic practitioners methods because they are the method that they have chosen to adopt. I have been there and have found that if you follow organics through to the letter as written by the SA you start treating organics as a religion. It is for this reason that I treat myself as Pragmatic. I do use artificial fertilizers because home compost and manure do not supply the correct formula for good growth. I use Herbicides in non productive areas because without them I would not be able to manage my plot. I have been know to use Herbicides on productive ground but only in instances where nothing else will help. I try very hard not to use Pesticides but if all else will fail I am prepared to use then. Again this would be in isolated instances. Now I have mentioned enough for Lord Peter Melchett to be wringing his hands in horror.
That man is what is wrong with the SA. He tries to use science to prove his point but when somebody uses science to disprove his findings science is no good you have to put it down to the 'feelings about it'.
Just who is he trying to kid? I'll tell you who!! The entire British Nation that's who!!
As I have stressed many times before organics as practiced by home gardeners and allotmenteers is fine
but commercially it will be a disaster and is a disaster waiting to happen.
Used world wide organic methods would create more problems than it would cure and mass starvation would be the outcome.
It is for this reason I gave up organics and became pragmatic and have taken a great interest in GM for almost ten years now. To me this is the way that we should be leaning. Not for the amateur or small grower but commercially.
JB.
Generally I have no real quarrel with organic practitioners methods because they are the method that they have chosen to adopt. I have been there and have found that if you follow organics through to the letter as written by the SA you start treating organics as a religion. It is for this reason that I treat myself as Pragmatic. I do use artificial fertilizers because home compost and manure do not supply the correct formula for good growth. I use Herbicides in non productive areas because without them I would not be able to manage my plot. I have been know to use Herbicides on productive ground but only in instances where nothing else will help. I try very hard not to use Pesticides but if all else will fail I am prepared to use then. Again this would be in isolated instances. Now I have mentioned enough for Lord Peter Melchett to be wringing his hands in horror.
That man is what is wrong with the SA. He tries to use science to prove his point but when somebody uses science to disprove his findings science is no good you have to put it down to the 'feelings about it'.
Just who is he trying to kid? I'll tell you who!! The entire British Nation that's who!!
As I have stressed many times before organics as practiced by home gardeners and allotmenteers is fine
but commercially it will be a disaster and is a disaster waiting to happen.
Used world wide organic methods would create more problems than it would cure and mass starvation would be the outcome.
It is for this reason I gave up organics and became pragmatic and have taken a great interest in GM for almost ten years now. To me this is the way that we should be leaning. Not for the amateur or small grower but commercially.
JB.
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Cider Boys
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Hello Johnboy
You express my sentiments better than I can.
What surprises me is the deafening silence from the pro- organic worshipers on this forum. Perhaps pragmatism is catching!!!
Best wishes
Barney
You express my sentiments better than I can.
What surprises me is the deafening silence from the pro- organic worshipers on this forum. Perhaps pragmatism is catching!!!
Best wishes
Barney
Hi Barney,
Dear God I do hope that this is the case. There has been so much myth and legend on this forum over the years. People who would not use rotovators because
they chopped worms up and condemned anybody who said they used them. We went through the Anti-Peat campaign which was deliberately orchestrated by the SA to practice emotional blackmail on us all. Then trying hard to scare mothers about their children if they ate conventional food.
There is nothing wrong with conventionally produced food whatever any person who practices organics says. We have a Food Safety Agency which works very well and we have a Pesticide Directive which is very on the ball. Integrated Pest Management Schemes are in place with all growers dealing with Supermarkets. These IPMS's are part and parcel of every Supermarket Chain's policy in the country.
What I found particularly galling on the programme was that the SA said well, other countries standards are not as high as ours yet what they failed to say was that most of that imported produce is sold under their logo. Contrary to the SA saying that home produce is increasing it is not increasing in line with the demand that they have created by their continually telling us a load of porkies.
I heard on the farming programme that most of the farmers that took
the government grant to go into intervention got so fed up with the SA that they simple waited until they didn't have to pay the government back and then simply went back to growing conventionally. The SA will not tell anybody how many organic farms there are but the last figure I heard was that of the 120000 UK farms less than 3000 were organic. No wonder we now have to import more organic food, not produced to, but sold under the SA logo. To my mind this is dishonest and the British Public in being conned left right and centre by the organic movement. To high a price for inferior vegetables.
Now I wish to remind people that I am talking about commercially produced organic vegetables and nothing to do with home grown produce.
JB.
Dear God I do hope that this is the case. There has been so much myth and legend on this forum over the years. People who would not use rotovators because
they chopped worms up and condemned anybody who said they used them. We went through the Anti-Peat campaign which was deliberately orchestrated by the SA to practice emotional blackmail on us all. Then trying hard to scare mothers about their children if they ate conventional food.
There is nothing wrong with conventionally produced food whatever any person who practices organics says. We have a Food Safety Agency which works very well and we have a Pesticide Directive which is very on the ball. Integrated Pest Management Schemes are in place with all growers dealing with Supermarkets. These IPMS's are part and parcel of every Supermarket Chain's policy in the country.
What I found particularly galling on the programme was that the SA said well, other countries standards are not as high as ours yet what they failed to say was that most of that imported produce is sold under their logo. Contrary to the SA saying that home produce is increasing it is not increasing in line with the demand that they have created by their continually telling us a load of porkies.
I heard on the farming programme that most of the farmers that took
the government grant to go into intervention got so fed up with the SA that they simple waited until they didn't have to pay the government back and then simply went back to growing conventionally. The SA will not tell anybody how many organic farms there are but the last figure I heard was that of the 120000 UK farms less than 3000 were organic. No wonder we now have to import more organic food, not produced to, but sold under the SA logo. To my mind this is dishonest and the British Public in being conned left right and centre by the organic movement. To high a price for inferior vegetables.
Now I wish to remind people that I am talking about commercially produced organic vegetables and nothing to do with home grown produce.
JB.