Hello all,
We are new to the forum, and fairly new to gardening actually, so may have many stupid questions for your amusement!
Anyway we are trying to grow organically and this year we want to set up a fruit cage. Every book we get seems to give different advice, but are plan is...
To plant blackcurrants, red currants, gooseberries, raspberrys and strawberries. Our site is a grassy south facing gradual slope with a hedge to the north, but exposed to the south and west. Without the time or patience to grow any windbreaks we thought we might dead hedge these exposed directions with some lop and top from the coppice. but, how near should the wind break be to the fruit cage? We'll make the cage probably about 10ft x 20ft. Then what..?
It's all grass at the moment so should we get a cultivator in or remove it? sounds like hard work. We thought we could manure in the holes where we plant the bushes, then cover it with weed barrier and mulch if so we'd need quite a bit so which is best and most cost effective?
Any other ideas, greatly appreciated
Thanks in advance
The Garliccats
Setting up our first fruit cage
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Elle's Garden
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Welcome to the forum Garliccats. I am afraid I can't help at all with your questions as I am new to all this myself - but wanted to say hello 
There are many others here who will be able to help you I am sure.
There are many others here who will be able to help you I am sure.
Kind regards,
Elle
Elle
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Geoff
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Welcome to the forum. First my usual comment to newcomers, please edit your profile to let us know where you are.
The first question about the fruit cage would be, is it on your own land or an allotment? Below I'm assuming you own it.
I have an exposed garden so believe in strong permanent structures. I have found in the past if you use traditional cage netting pegged down into grass you get problems with weeds tangling up with the bottom of the netting. I have taken the extreme solution of using a wall one breeze block high round the bottom but a more economical solution is gravel boards, you can then strim the outside without destroying netting and weed the inside. I would build a solid framework of tanalised round poles and 3x2 cross pieces, gravel boards all round then one metre high windbreak netting (the sort that is usually black plastic with oval holes in it), the rest of the height and the roof can be traditional cage netting or chicken wire (I use chicken wire). A good door for access with no gaps for birds.
Inside mine is completely bare with concrete dividing paths but again this is probably an extreme solution. You do have to remember though that for quite a period in the summer you are walking up and down many days picking fruit. Yours is not a massive area to clear, the paths could be anything fabric/bark, paving slabs or concrete like mine.
One of the problems is that Strawberries need fresh ground from time to time whereas the other stuff is permanent. I put my outdoor tomatoes in there as a break from Strawberries. If my maths is right you could use a layout with a 1' wide path down each long side (a bit of a squeeze but probably enough), then starting from one end 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of summer raspberries, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Autumn Raspberries, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Strawberries/Tomatoes, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Strawberries/Tomatoes, 1½' path, 3'x8' bed with 2 each Blackcurrants/Redcurrants/Gooseberries then a final 1½' path. I'll let others give you some varieties or contribute a simpler approach!
The first question about the fruit cage would be, is it on your own land or an allotment? Below I'm assuming you own it.
I have an exposed garden so believe in strong permanent structures. I have found in the past if you use traditional cage netting pegged down into grass you get problems with weeds tangling up with the bottom of the netting. I have taken the extreme solution of using a wall one breeze block high round the bottom but a more economical solution is gravel boards, you can then strim the outside without destroying netting and weed the inside. I would build a solid framework of tanalised round poles and 3x2 cross pieces, gravel boards all round then one metre high windbreak netting (the sort that is usually black plastic with oval holes in it), the rest of the height and the roof can be traditional cage netting or chicken wire (I use chicken wire). A good door for access with no gaps for birds.
Inside mine is completely bare with concrete dividing paths but again this is probably an extreme solution. You do have to remember though that for quite a period in the summer you are walking up and down many days picking fruit. Yours is not a massive area to clear, the paths could be anything fabric/bark, paving slabs or concrete like mine.
One of the problems is that Strawberries need fresh ground from time to time whereas the other stuff is permanent. I put my outdoor tomatoes in there as a break from Strawberries. If my maths is right you could use a layout with a 1' wide path down each long side (a bit of a squeeze but probably enough), then starting from one end 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of summer raspberries, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Autumn Raspberries, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Strawberries/Tomatoes, 1½' path, 2'x8' bed of Strawberries/Tomatoes, 1½' path, 3'x8' bed with 2 each Blackcurrants/Redcurrants/Gooseberries then a final 1½' path. I'll let others give you some varieties or contribute a simpler approach!
Hello GC
Welcome. There is a already lot of useful information on forum about fruit cages from previous postings so try the search button first.
Here are several points to help you which are much in agreement with what Geoff says.
Hope this helps
John
PS When you are eventually planting up remember to leave room around the edges so that you can get around inside the cage and the bushes don't start growing through the netting!
PPS When you are eventually up and running do remove the netting in the winter as even a moderate fall of snow will ground the best made fruit cage if you don't.
Welcome. There is a already lot of useful information on forum about fruit cages from previous postings so try the search button first.
Here are several points to help you which are much in agreement with what Geoff says.
- Its best to plan your fruit cage first especially if you are going to buy a kit as these are usually based on 6 or 8ft sections.
Soft fruit is a permanent crop that will be growing there for 10 or more years at least so it is MOST important to start with a clear weed free site. This is especially true for raspberries that are shallow rooting.
Strawberries are best grown for 2 or 3 years in the same bed then replaced with fresh plants in a different area. So they don't fit so well into a fruit cage scheme. I grow mine in a single row in with the rest of the veg and just protect the plants for a couple of months at fruiting time with a netting tunnel.
One fully grown well cultivated blackcurrant/redcuurant/gooseberry bush will produce loads of fruit more than enough for a family so don't be tempted into planting too many bushes.
Hope this helps
John
PS When you are eventually planting up remember to leave room around the edges so that you can get around inside the cage and the bushes don't start growing through the netting!
PPS When you are eventually up and running do remove the netting in the winter as even a moderate fall of snow will ground the best made fruit cage if you don't.
The Gods do not subtract from the allotted span of men’s lives, the hours spent fishing Assyrian tablet
What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning Werner Heisenberg
I am a man and the world is my urinal
What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning Werner Heisenberg
I am a man and the world is my urinal
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Garliccats
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Hello again and thanks for all your replies,
We learnt abit from our mistakes in our first year when we put up the veg raised beds. We had made about 8 rectangular beds in various sizes edged with chestnut logs, but with grass path ways inbetween, it looked really nice, but a real pain to strim. We also had to put up a deer and rabbit proof fence around the whole lot which obviously meant the grass growing up the chicken wire (even more of a pain to stim!) So Last winter we removed all the turf from the paths and about a foot outside the fencing and put down weed barrier and about 4 inches of hardwood chips. This has worked great from a maintenance point of view, but we're wondering if it has effected the fertility of the soil? We didn't do nearly as well in our 2nd year! Maybe there were a lot of tanins inthe woodchip, or maybe we didn't manure enough? Anyway so I can see the logic of putting some sort of barrier around the base of the cage, in our case we have access to some coppice timber so will probably use chestnut logs for the barrier and thought about hazel poles bent and tied together to make an arched profile to the cage. I guess we can adjust the size of the cage and hence the paths between the beds once we've planned it out.
Geoff do you need to do much weeding, or do your fruit bushes shade it enough to cover your bare earth? As it's grass at the moment, we'd rather put in the effort with a weed barrier and mulch to begin with rather than have to redesign it like we did the veg plot and if we do this, do we leave the grass and mulch over it? Bearing in mind our suspicions with the tanin in the woodchip, what other mulches have people used around their fruit bushes?
We already have a couple of blackcurrent bushes which have done well the last couple of years so we'll may move them to the cage and add gooseberries and raspberries, I think John Seymour's book on self sufficiency recommend these as the most viable, so we'd rather have too many than too few! we've found blackcurrents in particular freeze really well and if we run out of room in the freezer we have made fruit leathers with some success in a dehydrator, using stewed apples as a base and just adding seeds and other fruits we have to hand.
Thanks again for everyone's useful tips
Garliccats
We learnt abit from our mistakes in our first year when we put up the veg raised beds. We had made about 8 rectangular beds in various sizes edged with chestnut logs, but with grass path ways inbetween, it looked really nice, but a real pain to strim. We also had to put up a deer and rabbit proof fence around the whole lot which obviously meant the grass growing up the chicken wire (even more of a pain to stim!) So Last winter we removed all the turf from the paths and about a foot outside the fencing and put down weed barrier and about 4 inches of hardwood chips. This has worked great from a maintenance point of view, but we're wondering if it has effected the fertility of the soil? We didn't do nearly as well in our 2nd year! Maybe there were a lot of tanins inthe woodchip, or maybe we didn't manure enough? Anyway so I can see the logic of putting some sort of barrier around the base of the cage, in our case we have access to some coppice timber so will probably use chestnut logs for the barrier and thought about hazel poles bent and tied together to make an arched profile to the cage. I guess we can adjust the size of the cage and hence the paths between the beds once we've planned it out.
Geoff do you need to do much weeding, or do your fruit bushes shade it enough to cover your bare earth? As it's grass at the moment, we'd rather put in the effort with a weed barrier and mulch to begin with rather than have to redesign it like we did the veg plot and if we do this, do we leave the grass and mulch over it? Bearing in mind our suspicions with the tanin in the woodchip, what other mulches have people used around their fruit bushes?
We already have a couple of blackcurrent bushes which have done well the last couple of years so we'll may move them to the cage and add gooseberries and raspberries, I think John Seymour's book on self sufficiency recommend these as the most viable, so we'd rather have too many than too few! we've found blackcurrents in particular freeze really well and if we run out of room in the freezer we have made fruit leathers with some success in a dehydrator, using stewed apples as a base and just adding seeds and other fruits we have to hand.
Thanks again for everyone's useful tips
Garliccats
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Geoff
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I agree with John that fruit cages can catch the snow but if they are strong enough it doesn't matter. I also agree that total deep preparation is needed. I grow more than we can eat but barter surplus with a farmer for muck so I mulch quite heavily but still have to hand weed 2 or 3 times a year - for some reason I get a lot of Shepherd's Purse in there. I was going to cut down the Autumn Raspberries this week and shred them mixed with the Christmas tree and then mulch the Blueberries but that project looks a little unlikely.
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That's a really serious fruit cage, Geoff. I guess it could withstand a direct hit from the worst of blizzards. Mine is one of those TW kits of aluminium poles, nylon corner joints and thin netting, which works well but can't take any snow.
John
John
The Gods do not subtract from the allotted span of men’s lives, the hours spent fishing Assyrian tablet
What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning Werner Heisenberg
I am a man and the world is my urinal
What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning Werner Heisenberg
I am a man and the world is my urinal
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JohnN
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Hi Garlicats
As I've just had my fruit cage roof netting almost destroyed by the snow, I wish I'd removed it. But I wonder if, as the frame is fairly strong, sliding some garden canes at close intervals under the netting and across the top of the frame would prevent sagging, except in small "pockets"? My frame is 6 x 12ft and the vulnerable part of the frame is the centre horizontal strut, which I managed to prop up in the centre with a long-handled hoe wedged on an upturned beer crate!
Best wishes, JohnN.
As I've just had my fruit cage roof netting almost destroyed by the snow, I wish I'd removed it. But I wonder if, as the frame is fairly strong, sliding some garden canes at close intervals under the netting and across the top of the frame would prevent sagging, except in small "pockets"? My frame is 6 x 12ft and the vulnerable part of the frame is the centre horizontal strut, which I managed to prop up in the centre with a long-handled hoe wedged on an upturned beer crate!
Best wishes, JohnN.