'Organic has no health benefits'

[Cider Boys]

May I also welcome Pixley to this informative gardening forum.

Incidentally, I could not help but notice the often quoted organic phrase “let nature find its own balance”, what may I ask does this mean?

If we let nature find its own balance in this country we would be initially overcome by scrub and then forest, therefore man has to interfere to allow food production to flourish.

I have often stated that organic principles are extremely worthwhile but it seems that the organic brigade move one step too far in implying that any other means of gardening is without any benefits and in some cases evil.

Peter Seabrook is a fine knowledgeable gardener and his views should be respected as such. Of course he no longer finds favour with the politically correct BBC but was an extremely good presenter of Gardeners’ World. When presenter Monty Don took over he insisted that he would only mention and promote organic methods and the BBC naturally fawned to his desires. So we are now left with the licence payers only hearing one biased view for too many years, so no wonder the greenhorns know no better.

I also use as much sedge peat as I can and surely everyone has noticed the disgusting peat free compost now sold, it is useless.

Harsh but fair.

Barney

[pongeroon]

Each to their own methods Barney, but I use peat free compost, have done for years , and don't find it useless at all.

[pongeroon]

Or disgusting...

[Johnboy]

Hi Alan,
I do not propose to open the can of worms you are after. You know, when you do not reply but sit back and have a smug grin on your face.
I will though give you three instances. The organic writer who maintains that you shouldn't put F1 plant material on a compost heap because it doesn't rot down. Or the writer who wrote that newspaper should not be composted because the ink will contaminate your soil.
Lastly the stance taken by the organic brigade with regards to the introduction of GM. Lies, lies and more lies with the odd half truth thrown in.
JB.
Pongeroon,
Over the years in a quest not to use peat, it has literally cost me thousands of pounds on pallets of absolutely unusable Peat Free Crap!
JB.

[alan refail]

Hi Alan,
I will though give you three instances. The organic writer who maintains that you shouldn't put F1 plant material on a compost heap because it doesn't rot down. Or the writer who wrote that newspaper should not be composted because the ink will contaminate your soil.
Lastly the stance taken by the organic brigade with regards to the introduction of GM. Lies, lies and more lies with the odd half truth thrown in.
JB.

So, who are these people I can honestly say I've never read them

[Johnboy]

Alan,
One other thing that I should have mentioned was the report in an organic publication saying that the whole of the UK vegetables could be grown in Wales. Do you think that this could be even remotely true?
Of course Alan you remember every writer of everything you read!
Well I don't. And I have been dealing with gardening for a very long time
and certain anomalies stick in your memory.
Pick up almost any glossy magazine and you will find an article on how easy it is to be organic which means the writer is not telling the truth or
has not got a grasp even of growing not even the basics of growing which is all that Peter Seabrook was trying to say. You know the Monty Dons of this world. A presenter and not even remotely a gardener who ruined Gardeners World and has thankfully gone on to something even worse but keeps him off the television.
JB.

[glallotments]

I looked into what it means to be organic when the manure problem first cropped up.

I have to say that after I had read up on the subject I came to the conclusion that organic doesn't actually mean organic.

Garden Organic formally HDRA includes the following information on its web page

Manures and waste plants materials

Accepted:

Straw, hay and farmyard and horse manures from non-Organic sources - after being aerobically composted for three months or stockpiled for six months (The extra time is to allow some breakdown of any chemical residues that might be present.)

But six months is not an adequate length of time for aminopyralid to break down we are told that when stored in a pile it can take several years!

Qualified Acceptance

Plant wastes and by-products from non-Organic food processing industries, after being properly composted.
Mushroom composts made from non-Organic animal manures, except those from ‘Unacceptable’ intensive systems
Worm composts made from non-Organic animal manures, except those from ‘Unacceptable’ intensive systems
Commercial gardening products such as bagged manures and garden composts from non-Organic sources except those from ‘unacceptable’ production systems and those containing peat

It appears that as long as the manure/compost doesn't originate from intensive farming or contain peat then this is acceptable.

So even if we think we are being organic - are we being as organic as we think we are?

[PLUMPUDDING]

Everyone has their own reasons for growing their own food, the majority do it because they want to know exactly what they are eating - fresh, best flavoured varieties, not covered in chemicals etc, so there really is no doubt that you are going to enjoy what you grow more than bought stuff you have no control over. Just knowing this makes me much happier about my food, and I know it is better for my health despite what the government has paid someone to say.

When the report came out I wondered what they had made this strange announcement for. Now we know. Does the government think everyone is stupid and won't notice?

Surprise surprise, this week following them saying organic produce is no better for you than ordinary stuff, they are now flooding the media with the idea that we will all starve if we don't start growing Genetically Modified crops in the UK. They know full well that most people don't want to eat genetically modified crops that are adapted to withstand having herbicides and goodness knows what else done to them, and that GM crops pose a threat of cross-pollination to organic and normally grown crops. So they had to de-value the organic idea before they launched this.

[alan refail]

The Welsh Assembly Government is maintaining as restrictive and cautious a stance as is within its limited powers on GM crops.

[PLUMPUDDING]

I might have to move to Wales then Alan.