Brassica whitefly

[FredFromOssett]

Has anyone found a way to get rid of brassica whitefly? I've tried a method I had seen recommended, namely spraying with a jet of water to dislodge them. All this seems to do is give them some exercise, as they fly around for a couple of minutes, making sure there are no plants they've previously missed, before returning. It seems to do little or nothing to get rid of them. Does anyone have a magic remedy, bearing in mind that we should like the brassicas to remain edible.

[Chantal]

Hi Fred

JB has many times advocated the use of nicotine spray for bugs such as white fly and flea beetle.

Someone else posted a method of making the stuff and it's apparently quite legal so long as you use it on your plants and not to polish off some rich relative.

Get 4oz of used filter tip cigarette ends or tobacco and simmer in 2 pints of water for 30 mins topping up as required. Strain through nylon stocking, dilute it by adding 4 parts water to 1 part of the solution. Mark container POISON. Keep off skin and out of eyes. It breaks down in 48 hours, so there is no build up in the soil.
I've used it a few times it works well.
It can be used wooly aphids, on apple trees by adding a little soft soap to the mix.

You might want to simmer this brew outside, as the smell is YUK.



Seedling brewed some last year and can vouch for the smell

[Primrose]

And if you're a non-smoker, a few minutes grovelling on the pavement outside any pub will rapidly yield your 4 oz of used filter tip fag ends ! But I'm not sure this will do much for your best kitchen saucepans.

[Johnboy]

Hi Primrose,
I am having difficulty imagining you grovelling on the pavement for anything.
For good or evil I am a smoker and save all my dogends to make nicotine spray which I boil up out in the barn in an old saucepan that used to be used for boiling scraps for the chickens when I had some.
This year however I am going to grow some Tobacco and try to reduce it to a liquid using the same method used to make Comfrey concentrate.
Nicotine got a bad name simply because of the anti-smoking lobby and the gross stupidity of the Soil Association. Used as it was intended, Nicotine is a superb organic pesticide. It is a complete killer and to use it on brassicas is a surefire way to get rid of White Fly. It is best used when the Bees have gone to bed as it will kill them as well. Not that there is anything on Brassicas that will attract Bees.
For those who will condemn Nicotine because it is indiscriminate spray and will also kill things that are beneficial. Then it is up to the user to make sure that where they spray is protected. Use some fleece over your brassicas and spray under the fleece.
When spraying, the normal methods of safety should be adhered to.
JB.

[Arnie]

Hi Johnboy,

Does it have to be filter tipped cigarette ends or can it be hand rolled My allotment neighbour rolls his own (I am a none smoker ) and he also grows his own tobacco or used to, would you like me to try and get you some seed if I can

Best Wishes & Kind Regards

Kevin

[Johnboy]

Hi Kevin,
I roll my own cigarettes and that's best. You need to cut the filters off before boiling as you need only the tobacco.
A few seeds if he can spare them would be marvelous.
JB.

[Beryl]

We had a very interesting gardening talk given by Ray Broughton from Sparshalt College on Tuesday.
He also works at the RHS Wisley.

He said none of the old remedies for whitefly will work because we now have a new strain from South Africa and in fact they are a moth as opposed to a fly.

A fine jet of water was about the only thing that would remotely help.

Beryl.

[Johnboy]

Hi Beryl,
There are new strains of White Fly entering the country and the worst of them is the Tobacco White Fly and this did not come from South Africa. It started out as tropical species in South America and has ravaged the Canary Islands then had a crack at Israel and then Portugal then Spain and is currently going through France heading our way. As this fly has travelled it has hardened-up and is now no longer classed a tropical species and is coming into this country on imported produce daily and has been doing so for a number of years. I can well imagine that it is possible that there are colonies of them establishing in the south of the country by now.
However Nicotine will kill them.
The Tobacco White Fly is known to carry several plant viruses with it and to treat them with a jet of water I would consider an act of gross negligence.
I am afraid that this is where I fall out with Organic Gardeners who will take what your speaker said as gospel and do nothing to try and rid the country of this very serious pest. Tomato growers in Spain were having to do as many as six sowings to establish a crop about five years ago so what measures they have taken by now I am not sure as I no longer take the Grower Magazine.
Used responsibly Nicotine is a superb Organic Pesticide and is available to commercial growers but I am not sure for home gardeners. It is very expensive (last time I saw a price around £90 a litre) and is produced by Vitax. As was previously mentioned I make my own and that keeps me free from White Fly. As it is most of my produce is protected with Anti White Fly netting but I had some gale damage that I failed to notice and got some White Fly on Brassicas within four days. I treated with Nicotine using 1.5litres of made-up spray and that was three years ago and I am pleased to say that although I hold a stock of Nicotine I have not used any for three years or any other pesticide.
JB.

[Beryl]

All gets a bit complicated for me Johnboy but there is a piece on the Defra web site that says and I quote

'The whole life cycle takes about 30 days at 25°C. Development is halted at temperatures below 10°C and therefore in the UK, the tobacco whitefly is only likely to be a pest of protected crops.'

Full article at
http://www.defra.gov.uk/planth/pestpics/qic6.htm

Presumably then the Tobacco whitefly is not the same one we all have on the lottie and in our gardens.

Regards Beryl.

[Johnboy]

Hi Beryl,
I appreciate what you are saying but what must be considered is the fact that less than 10 years ago the Tobacco White Fly was a tropical species and as the years have gone by it has hardened itself up and it is possible that the DEFRA website is now out of date. Beyond a shadow of doubt that if it has not colonised yet it is not going to be very long before it does.
The important thing to me is that it must be killed off and not sprayed with water and pushed on to some other unsuspecting gardener. I accused Organic Gardeners of being selfish the other week and this is a classic example of the selfishness I mean.
There are times when pesticides must be used. These wonderful dreams of producing wonderful crops year after year without the use of pesticides are but a myth because pests build up and there will come a time when everybody will be in trouble.
I don't know about you Beryl but I grow crops to eat and if I wanted to feed the animals I go to the zoo and not watch my hard earned crops being ravaged by pests.
JB.

[Beryl]

I agree with you Johnboy I grow crops to eat and take as many preventative precautions as I can and I don't spray unless there is no alternative. Whitefly is not one that really bothers me that much I was just passing on information. As in all these debates it is up to the individual to weight up the pros and cons and do what is right for them.

Beryl.

PS Defra page was last modifield 10th Oct.2006.

[CradleyMike]

Interesting to see this topic, our whole allotment appeared to be under a cloud of whitefly last weekend (perhaps a slight exaggeration). They don't really bother me too much, but this year they appear to be in greater numbers at the moment, earlier in the year there were very few I guess this is connected with our strange summer weather.

[Beryl]

Yes, I think it is the warm moist weather that encourages them. A few good hard frosts should at least see some of them off.

Beryl.

[Elderflower]

I know I`ve posted this before but - - I`m usually plagued by brassica whitefly but this year there`s nery a one on the cabbages etc.
I wish I knew why - - I`d do it every year!

[FredFromOssett]

Dear Elderflower, you are more than welcome to some of mine!