A New Kitchen Garden from a paddock?

[peter]

Hesitant suggesstion.

If you have a spare room, pot up a sensible selection from all the seedlings into three inch diameter pots, fit a wallpaper table or three in the room (any fold up table will do) with a suitable waterproof surface on them and fit some "growlights".

These lights can be expensive and burn lots of 'lecky.

I stress the words "sensible selection" as what you pot up will get bigger and need potting up again later in the year. This way you can salvage something ready for an early start. Some folk say that a potbound seedling will be slower to get away than a fresh seedling, but it is worth doing some.

Please do not be too enthusiastic about purchasing lots of the lights, or you may get visited by your local drug squad.

Where you went wrong?

You got it all right.

Perfect germinating conditions, remember what you did for a few months time.

[Hannabusses]

i think deep down after the first few days i felt that it might be the case ho hum, a definate case of live and learn i shall take it in my stride grab a couple of the best seedlings and get a grow light and hang off for a month or so then try again. Definately going to count the seeds in next time i dont want another tomato lawn to appear! Thanks for confirming my fears though it does help. (cough: no more proping up thin straggly seedlings with matches lol)

[Geoff]

I haven't read every post in detail - you've generated such a good discussion - but I noticed a couple of references to planning permission for a greenhouse. Have you already got permission for change of use for the paddock from agriculture to garden? I live in a barn I converted just over 20 years ago with 1½ acres of ex agricultural land, not exactly paddock more rough upland grazing with rushes. I thought my conversion planning permission included change of use of the land then I got a letter of complaint from the Council after they came to look at a neighbour's planning issue. It turned out the architect had submitted a wrong plan so most of my garden was illegal. I got away with it because I had been cultivating it for over 10 years without them noticing!
I made my veg garden as beds similar to yours, 8 off 25'x10', but not raised. I drained them by dividing them with concrete paths with drains under them. Much easier to add muck and compost on the level with a wheelbarrow. Beds are great for planning rotations.
Three things I haven't noticed mentioned are composting, comfrey and soft fruit. I've made a line of 6 compost bins of about 4' cubes out of breeze blocks with slatted wood fronts and most of one of my beds is permanent comfrey that I use as a compost activator. With all that space you could build a massive soft fruit cage (See "The Fruit Garden Displayed" I think has a design). The time spent / value produced ratio is probably higher for soft fruit than veg.
Good look time wise. I worked full time (and still do) whilst doing the house and garden but had the advantage of a 10 minute commute so long evenings to work. I've often spent 30-40 hours a week in the garden and had difficulty developing it. It's like the plates spinning on sticks, you break one area in but you have to look after it while developing the next bit.

[Hannabusses]

Thanks Geoff some great points, and its super to hear from a person who has done pretty much exactly what i am doing.

Planning.. yes i had thought about that element and because of how the garden plot sits the paddock is basicaly the bottom east corner yet still kind of integeral looking to the garden , while i might need to get permission i really cant think of a reason to moan about it as its not veiwed by anyone other than sheep and birds. Also i want toi wait for the green house permission rather than ask for more things just yet. I also have my eye on the farmers 20 acre field but thats another story (i would like to build 4 nice holiday chalets for people who want to come on holiday to work on a garden plot).

Drainage.. at the mom just well dug and it seems to be draining moderately well but im going to keep an eye on that. Once the beds are fully built i will think about sorting the paths and maybe follow your drain idea that would make sense yes.

Raised beds.. with the size and amount of material required to RAISE the beds i am taking this appraoch. I lifted the turf and made a bank 20ft long 5 foot wide and 3 foot high this i have covered in very thick black polythene sheeting, im going to leave that for 1year and dig it onto the beds next winter when it should be (ill blame Alison if its not lol) very good condition loam. For now i have rotavated the soil and dug in 250 70 ltr bags of compost and i will be fixing the wooden surrounds in the next couple of weeks.

Soft fruit.. you read my mind i have alot that i need to find a place for i have decided to use the old veg plot that the previous owners used to grow fruit. so to that aim this last weekend i double dug it and mixed in some compost, next weekend i will plant and think over my netting options. Should i put black plastic down and plant the fruit plants thrugh it?? I see my existing fruit cage with rasbs has that shame its not big enough for my plans. Also
the PH at that part of the garden is 6.5 which is normally good i hear but i also read that blueberrys like an acid soil does that go for most fruit and if not how do i raise teh PH for a part of the fruit plot? Sulphur? is that organic?

As for composting yes already i have filled my 3 big bins so im going to do similar to you and build some new ones and make use of the free plant food. Comfry well i have had that one my mind for a while but not actually seen any around anywhere to buy and grow, historically people seem to give each other cuttings or can you buy it anywhere?

[Didee]

My experience of conditions here in Central Portugal might not be of any use whatsoever, but here goes: 18 months ago we moved here and my first priority was to create a kitchen garden. Not wanting to use herbicides, I strimmed the (thigh-high!) grass and dug over the soil burying the turf a spit under. I originally left wide grass paths between each bed, but quickly found that it caused umpteen problems, as I couldn't keep up with the mowing to keep the weeds down and the grass and weeds seeded themselves into my new beds. We have a small stream next to the kitchen garden, well, it was small at the time. Once the rain came in early spring, the water came flooding down from the surrounding hills flowing through our farm on its way downstream, flooding my veggies in the process and carrying off some of the mulches I'd applied. I have since tried to earth up the banks on the kitchen garden side, with the intention of diverting the floods into the orchard on the other side of the stream. I'm reluctant to relocate the garden as it ceases to be a problem once the rains stop, in about May. The soil banks have worked to a certain extent, although the chickens had a good scratch about in some of the new banks and distributed the soil.

[Hannabusses]

yes the grass paths between a couple of the beds did prove to be a pain but i figure next year when they officially become raised that should no longer be a problem.

1.5 acres of garden including my veg beds has come to be LOTS of work! Its taken up most of my weekends and i have a gardener that helps out for 5 hours a week.. My nice hartley greenhouse eventually arrived mid may.. missing alot of the seed growing part of the.. because of that all the bits i have grown this year were done on window ledges in the house (my wife wasnt so pleased)

Still i think i have done quite well..
I have grown alot of bits.. some now in the greenhouse and much of it in the veg patch..

SLUGS have proven to be my nemasis.. almost anything i put in the ground young and fresh looking gets hit.. they seem to give up after a while but its depressing to see pea's brassicas potatoes and beans moth eaten over night.. i have slug traps, used nemaslug and am now using organic slug pellets but nothing stops tehm completely (i cant bring myself to buy copper collars to go around each plant!!)..

[oldherbaceous]

Dear Hannabusses, nice to see you are sticking in there, i thought we had lost you.

[Jenny Green]

Hannabusses, it's very likely that the slugs you mention are living in your grass paths and visiting the beds at night. While grass paths look pretty, they're a lot of work that could be spent on more profitable activities, such as tending your vegetables.
I think you can guess what I'm saying here! I speak from experience.
Well done for all your hard work. Any chance of some photos of your vast garden?

[Didee]

Hello Hannabusses,
no doubt someone somewhere else has said this already - I use natural bran to stave them off and it really works. Slugs here in Portugal are huge, brown things that could eat your cat. I place a ring of it round vulnerable plants, replenish it after rain, and I get 100% success. I used to do this when I lived in London, too, and we had big black so and sos there (not quite cat-eating size, but nearly), and everything survived, including outdoor cucumbers and salad. We ordered a big sack from our local pet shop and it worked out dead cheap. Give it a go.

[Compo]

I am in the bran club too, it costs five quid for a big sack from our farm suppliers. Spread it around young tender seedlings etc and it keeps the buggers off, lasts about a month in the summer and this is enough to get most brassica / bean and salad seedlings off to a good start. You can apply more after the month but I find that the plants are then established enough not to be bothered by a bit of nibbling. I also think that raised beds, kept clean and free of refuse are useful. I pulled some potatoes the other day and left the dead haulms on top of the bed for a few days, we had a few showers and the slugs and snails started lurking under it.

However, Geoff and Hannabusses your projects sound great and very exciting, whats a few molluscs between friends eh?

Compo

[Hannabusses]

Hey everyone.. ok lets see if i can post some pics

1) The paddock before.. dec 06
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077153647417870818

2) I begin
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077153703252445682

3) A couple now that i have planted and things are coming up.
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077151693207751090

http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077150043940309266

4) New greenhouse.
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077151628783241634

5) lawnmower
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077151564358732178

6) view down my spring (u cant see the water but its there belive me just a bad piccy)
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077145130497722546

7)herb garden
http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077151761927227842

http://picasaweb.google.com/ianbatchelor/UntitledAlbum/photo?authkey=1TpZHkRBTiw#5077149846371813602

fingers crossed this all works

[Gilly C]

All looks superb ! love the very posh greenhouse ! and my hubby would love the mower you will be reaping the rewards for your labours for many years !

[Primrose]

Lovely photos, and what a huge plot. You're going to grow an awful lot of produce once it all starts being productive. How many in your household to consume it all? Hope you have some large freezers for your surplus. You might find you won't have finished eating it all before the next year's crops start arriving !

[retropants]

WOW!!! I'm soooooo greeeeen!!
lucky you, that is a beautiful house and a superb plot, looks idyllic, but also hard work too, it looks like you have been super busy, well done, hope you get lots of produce to enjoy this year!
Emma.