Tomato fever.

[FelixLeiter]

Back to tomato and considering what I read from Monty Don i'm thinking it would take many years of growing and tasting the results together with considering the effects of changing weather to able to advise other without seeming to pontificate.

I grew over 200 varieties of tomatoes for a trial some years ago. Of those, the tastiest and most resilient were chosen for growing on in subsequent years. The results from those further trials were mixed, depending on how the season progressed. All were grown in tunnels, given no artificial heat beyond that needed to raise them. It proved that mostly it was not what you grow, but how you grow it. Or more to the point, how they coped with the weather. To an extent, anyway — the right variety does help. If you can remove the vagaries of the weather, of course, then so much the better, which is why such good quality tomatoes are in our shops, grown under glass where their environment is precisely controlled.

I've also compared grafted plants with their un-grafted counterparts. Grafting does not guarantee a crop, it protects only against soil-borne diseases — there is no protection against blight, for instance, which is the usual reason British tomatoes' prospects come to a rapid halt. If soil-borne diseases are present, then there is an advantage, but if the soil remains healthy there is no measurable difference. This is not me poo-pooing grafted tomatoes, absolutely not, but I do want to emphasise that grafting is an insurance policy, not an investment.

[Ricard with an H]

Thanks for those interesting points Felix, presumably if you grow in a medium that has been treated for soil borne disease, I assume this includes general purpose composts, there is little need for grafting.

If this is what you're saying then the marketing of grafted tomato plants is hyped up to get us to believe something else, like guaranteed masses of juicy tomato and that growing from seed is for weirdo's.

The few tomatoes I have grown, this will be my second time, have been from seed taken from tomatoes. I'm already a weirdo for doing that and not either buying my plants or sowing seed from packets.

The first time was from tiny sweet tomato from Sainsbury, the plants produced small tasty and sweet just like the parent so why wouldn't I do this again. The ones that are growing in my greenhouse-tent are looking as they will achieve about the same of about 50 to 60 mm diameter slicing tomato and the taste will depend on how I nurture them. Hopefully feeding them with comfrey will mean I can recommend the process because i'm not entirely sure/confident about some store-bought nutrients compared to the performance of cow-poo in one case and comfrey in another.

[PLUMPUDDING]

I've found the same Felix, varieties that taste wonderful in a warm sunny summer can be average in a dull wet year like last year, although they the good flavoured ones still taste better than ones that are poor any way.

Not sure what Monty Don said, but I don't take much notice of him anyway. He always seems to be talking from a script even if he is enthusiastic about something.

If you choose a well flavoured variety, that suits your taste, and feed it well you should get good results despite the vagaries of the weather - if you grow it under cover in a greenhouse. Outdoors it is more a case of pot luck.

I've also tried growing from seeds taken from particularly tasty supermarket tomatoes bought before mine start producing and find the best flavoured ones are usually Italian varieties. They also seem to come true to type for the first year anyway.

Personally I've not needed to use grafted tomatoes so can't comment on them.

I rarely grow f1 seeds and keep seeds from my own heritage varieties, so they always grow true to type anyway. I had joined an American tomato seed swap and ended up with about 50 different varieties. I've whittled them down to about 20 that are worth growing and cover lots of different colours, sizes and flavours.

[FelixLeiter]

I had joined an American tomato seed swap and ended up with about 50 different varieties. I've whittled them down to about 20 that are worth growing and cover lots of different colours, sizes and flavours.

I'd be interested to compare notes. From previous trials i have, alas, found most of the varieties which are championed in the States were disappointing when grown here, even over successive years. Brandywine, in particular, is held in wide regard over there, but it's middling to poor when faced with, for better or worse, a British summer. Maybe under glass it's worthwhile, but I don't know.

[Ricard with an H]

You both may have raised an issue that I only just thought of, 'personal taste'.

It took me fifteen years to decide that I don't like Rioja whatever they choose to call it. During those fifteen years of dedicated tasting and testing I cornered a few grape varieties that hit the spot for me though some grape types taste quite different because of the region or handling.

Presumably in the same way there is no defining taste or type that sets a tomato above all others which might explain the popularity of growing tomatoes.

[Motherwoman]

Some people like a sharp flavour, others a sweet one. But the taste depends on how they are grown. If your soil is gutless then so will your tomato be.

The grafted toms that I used to do filled a very old tomato house that had been growing toms for maybe 30 years in the same soil, occasionally it was steam serilised but otherwise was starting the give problems. I wouldn't bother with them now.

I still grow my toms in soil and just alternate cues and toms from side to side each year. I take out two trenches in about January and fill it with the contents of my compost bin that takes the kitchen veg waste, teabags etc. Then backfill the soil. I don't do any other feeding and they do fine.

I like saving seed too, I let my tom seed pulp go mouldy for a few days in a jar, then wash it off in a sieve and dry in a saucer. I store when dry in old film canisters, great seal on the lid. Spanish Globe is a favourite and Salt Spring Sunrise which has an odd growth habit, it has a truss where the lead shoot should be and throws out a lead shoot from a leaf axil! But it fruits well and ripens early.

MW

[FelixLeiter]

Salt Spring Sunrise which has an odd growth habit, it has a truss where the lead shoot should be and throws out a lead shoot from a leaf axil! But it fruits well and ripens early.

One of my favourites. It is very badly behaved, though, I have to agree. You wouldn't want it in the greenhouse. But then you don't need to — I've found it to be very reliable.

Regarding taste, I grow different tomatoes for different purposes. Some plum varieties, for instance, are not very nice eaten raw, a bit "pithy", but they're terrific in the pot. I'd never cook with cherry varieties although many people do and you can buy them tinned. They have skins on, though. Me, I don't want skins when I'm cooking with them.

[Ricard with an H]

Fantastic information from you assortment of expertise and experience that I couldn't get from book reading or magazines. It's getting logged into the grey-cells but you do know what happens, don't you ?

I think I prefer the sharp taste and why i've been drooling over these Co-op tomatoes I bought recently that are proving to be such a nice stop-gap. I like to slice them at summer-warm temperature, then salt them and leave to assemble flavours.

These last few contributions on the subject have really-really got me making plans for a 10 X 6 though I do wish my lovely lady would eat what I grow. She is big on beans but not keen of salad stuff and tomato. Potato brings out the Irish in her but i'm not a big potato eater until I get my preferences sorted. Some salad spuds are so lovely I can't stop but i'm piling on butter at a time i'm trying to keep down to my fighting-weight.

[FelixLeiter]

I like to slice them at summer-warm temperature, then salt them and leave to assemble flavours.

Ah now, you've hit on something there, RIchard. I'm baffled as to why anyone would keep tomatoes in the fridge. They're awful chilled. Keeping them at room temperature they continue to ripen, or in any case develop their flavour more. I don't know why eggs get kept in the fridge, either. Or jam. It's a preserve, isn't it? Or butter. I don't understand about spreadable butter. If you want butter that spreads, just don't keep it in the fridge.

[Motherwoman]

I keep mine in a bowl on the kitchen unit; as is my butter and my eggs are in a wire hen on a shaded window sill. My jam is OK not in a fridge but shop bought doesn't seem to keep as well as it used to, probably cutting down on the sugar in it nowadays.

With you on the butter on the spuds Richard... and the beans and the carrots and the courgettes...oh dear

MW

[peter]

Commercial jam definitely has a lower sugar content, apparently traditional UK style jam is on the way out due to "healthy eating" reasons.


Usual nonsense of nanny state trying to enforce stuff instead of allowing free choice while quietly advising moderate consumption.

Amusing ironic consequences are first more food waste as people chuck out more mouldy jam and greater risks of upset stomachs from jam on the turn. So two othe state funded pressure-group / campaigns will have to step up........

I like any jam but don't eat much of it, dad used to make all sorts, even Medlar jelly.