I expect the "seeds or sets" question has been asked before. However for Banana shallots, availability may help decide things.
Many of us want to grow these (JB has championed us well!). However I think that those who have obtained seed haven't had brilliant results (weather may have played a part this year).
In the meantime, you seem to be able to buy the actual shallots in veg shops without too much trouble. Thus I'm wondering why not just use these as sets? Is the main objection that, to grow any sizeable quantity the cost is going to be a bit steep?
I have the luxury of only a half allotment, so I'm never going to have room for more than a few rows. JB, are you looking for greater quantities? Or is the question of uncertain source, introducing pests/viruses also a question?
Banana Shallots - seed or sets?
Moderators: KG Steve, Chantal, Tigger, peter
-
Garlic_Guy
- KG Regular
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 8:55 pm
- Location: Bristol
- Contact:
Good morning Colin and Sprout,
Last week I obtained 10 BS and it was my intention to dissect 5 and grow 5 on knowing that this is the wrong end of the year to start anything seriously.
I suspended 5 into shallow water and withing 24 hours they had plumped up and within 48 hours new roots were visible so I planted the 5 in pots on the bench in one of my tunnels.
The other 5 I dissected and the results were less than favourable. Two had no means of division and would have gone straight to seed one had means to divide into 3 and two would have split into 2.
So the most I could have possibly obtained were 7 BS and decided there and then that they were not a viable proposition and that the French must grow them from seed. This has subsequently been confirmed by yourself and Piglet.
I fried those that I had dissected and they were super and pulled up the other 5 and they met the same fate because I realised that I was on a loser!
I feel that the French have managed to perfect the growth of BS and there is absolutely no reason why we cannot get together and be successful.
I mean that the reputation of British growers is at stake!! The thing is are we going to allow the French to supply something that we surely must be able to grow.
I have retired Colin and now only grow for myself and carry out various experiments to further my own knowledge and it could be said that I am now playing
at it. The one thing I love most of all is a challenge. Banana Shallots is next years Challenge!!!
Last week I obtained 10 BS and it was my intention to dissect 5 and grow 5 on knowing that this is the wrong end of the year to start anything seriously.
I suspended 5 into shallow water and withing 24 hours they had plumped up and within 48 hours new roots were visible so I planted the 5 in pots on the bench in one of my tunnels.
The other 5 I dissected and the results were less than favourable. Two had no means of division and would have gone straight to seed one had means to divide into 3 and two would have split into 2.
So the most I could have possibly obtained were 7 BS and decided there and then that they were not a viable proposition and that the French must grow them from seed. This has subsequently been confirmed by yourself and Piglet.
I fried those that I had dissected and they were super and pulled up the other 5 and they met the same fate because I realised that I was on a loser!
I feel that the French have managed to perfect the growth of BS and there is absolutely no reason why we cannot get together and be successful.
I mean that the reputation of British growers is at stake!! The thing is are we going to allow the French to supply something that we surely must be able to grow.
I have retired Colin and now only grow for myself and carry out various experiments to further my own knowledge and it could be said that I am now playing
at it. The one thing I love most of all is a challenge. Banana Shallots is next years Challenge!!!
JB.
-
Deb P
- KG Regular
- Posts: 301
- Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:09 pm
- Location: Derbyshire
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 2 times
I must confess, after all the hoo ha bringing back some huge banana shallots back from France earlier this year, we ate half (yummy) and planted the rest to see what would happen. None grew well, and the upshot is we ate the lot a couple of weeks ago, none were going to set seed. Rats.
-
Garlic_Guy
- KG Regular
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 8:55 pm
- Location: Bristol
- Contact:
So if we think the French grow from seed, the next things is to send some search parties over and buy some of their seed.
Over the past few years, I've brought back seed for tomatoes and red onions from Italy. Their packets are actually marked with the European regions/climate zones to help with sowing times. All have grown ok.
I'm sure there must be a few of us KG's going over. How about finding room for a few packets, then splitting them between us?
Over the past few years, I've brought back seed for tomatoes and red onions from Italy. Their packets are actually marked with the European regions/climate zones to help with sowing times. All have grown ok.
I'm sure there must be a few of us KG's going over. How about finding room for a few packets, then splitting them between us?
We are off to Normandy in september and one of the aims is to blag some seed so I will try to get extra packets for others.
In addition I have a whole raised bed full of banana shallots running to seed and hopefully will have plenty from them for myself and to share.
JB how to I save the seed as I have never collected it before
In addition I have a whole raised bed full of banana shallots running to seed and hopefully will have plenty from them for myself and to share.
JB how to I save the seed as I have never collected it before
If you're successful in blagging piglet, I would love to try some seed too - if you have room for more takers 
I can offer heritage toms, oriental veg seed and unusual squash seed as swopsies
I feel a bit cheeky asking but like Johnboy says, this is a challenge!
I wonder if KG would sponsor a trial by its online community
I can offer heritage toms, oriental veg seed and unusual squash seed as swopsies
I feel a bit cheeky asking but like Johnboy says, this is a challenge!
I wonder if KG would sponsor a trial by its online community
Not sure, but probably in the same way as for onions. Tie a bag over the ripe flower head. I seem to remember seeing onions in a neighbourhood garden years ago, all with paper bags tied over the flower head.
I just found the following by googling:
<The onion puts out a flower stalk that ends in a capsule. The capsule looks much like a larger version of the end of a garlic scape but instead of bulbils, it'll go to seed. This opens up and puts out a compound flower. Once the onion flowers, you're left with a nicely spread flower head of maturing onion seed that looks like lots of dark colored dots. Around this time, you can cut off the stalks, put them in a paper bag - head first - and tie off the end of the bag or you can wait for the heads to dry down a bit and do the same thing. Hang the bags in a nice, airy, dry location for a couple of weeks to let them get really dry and then you're ready for threshing. Simply put, threshing is merely separating the seed from the rest of the plant. If you've bagged the seed heads, just shake them back and forth vigorously for a minute or so and all the seeds will have dropped to the bottom of the bag along with a little other dried stuff. Depending on how much chaff (non-seed) is in the bag, you may just be able to dump the bag into a sieve and let the clean seed fall through or shake in a bowl and pick the chaff off the top.>
So I wasn't far off
I just found the following by googling:
<The onion puts out a flower stalk that ends in a capsule. The capsule looks much like a larger version of the end of a garlic scape but instead of bulbils, it'll go to seed. This opens up and puts out a compound flower. Once the onion flowers, you're left with a nicely spread flower head of maturing onion seed that looks like lots of dark colored dots. Around this time, you can cut off the stalks, put them in a paper bag - head first - and tie off the end of the bag or you can wait for the heads to dry down a bit and do the same thing. Hang the bags in a nice, airy, dry location for a couple of weeks to let them get really dry and then you're ready for threshing. Simply put, threshing is merely separating the seed from the rest of the plant. If you've bagged the seed heads, just shake them back and forth vigorously for a minute or so and all the seeds will have dropped to the bottom of the bag along with a little other dried stuff. Depending on how much chaff (non-seed) is in the bag, you may just be able to dump the bag into a sieve and let the clean seed fall through or shake in a bowl and pick the chaff off the top.>
So I wasn't far off
Tricia
Hi Piglet,
I would suggest that you try making some Muslin bags 'cos paper ones go rather soggy in the rain.
Really the paper ones that Tricia has seen is an attempt to prevent cross pollination. Somehow I think if yours are in flower now it is too late to worry about that now though. Once the seed has set if you place the muslin bags over and await the plant beginning to keel over then cut on longish stalks and hang up in the garage to dry. Bash the bagged heads on you hand which is like threshing. When they are dry rub the seeds lightly twixt your hands and you can blow the husk away in a winnowing action.
Alternatively; do how ever many you need to keep for your needs and send the rest to the people who want seed so they can do it for themselves.
As for winnowing I normally do this in a cereal bowl and very gently blow the husks away leaving the seeds in the bowl. When you do not have any seed in the bowl you have blown too hard!
I would suggest that you try making some Muslin bags 'cos paper ones go rather soggy in the rain.
Really the paper ones that Tricia has seen is an attempt to prevent cross pollination. Somehow I think if yours are in flower now it is too late to worry about that now though. Once the seed has set if you place the muslin bags over and await the plant beginning to keel over then cut on longish stalks and hang up in the garage to dry. Bash the bagged heads on you hand which is like threshing. When they are dry rub the seeds lightly twixt your hands and you can blow the husk away in a winnowing action.
Alternatively; do how ever many you need to keep for your needs and send the rest to the people who want seed so they can do it for themselves.
As for winnowing I normally do this in a cereal bowl and very gently blow the husks away leaving the seeds in the bowl. When you do not have any seed in the bowl you have blown too hard!
JB.
Hi Johnboy and others
When cleaning / winnowing seed (of any type), its a good idea to wear safety glasses as the chaff and seed husk particles can get into your eyes and cause problems.
I tried growing banana shallots from ones I'd purchased from the 'French market' which visits a number of towns in the UK - no success in getting them to grow and I suspect they had been heat treated to stop them growing.
When cleaning / winnowing seed (of any type), its a good idea to wear safety glasses as the chaff and seed husk particles can get into your eyes and cause problems.
I tried growing banana shallots from ones I'd purchased from the 'French market' which visits a number of towns in the UK - no success in getting them to grow and I suspect they had been heat treated to stop them growing.
Piglet,
I shall be you're equivalent to "A Hug in A Mug" when you go to France in September....
No, honestly, I've got it all worked out.
If you and Kaz key your whereabouts into the 'puter, Trousers and me will find you......
What flavour you fancy? Garlic, Banana Shallot or Road-Kill Jelly?!
Wellie
X
I shall be you're equivalent to "A Hug in A Mug" when you go to France in September....
No, honestly, I've got it all worked out.
If you and Kaz key your whereabouts into the 'puter, Trousers and me will find you......
What flavour you fancy? Garlic, Banana Shallot or Road-Kill Jelly?!
Wellie
X
What sunshine is to flowers, smiles are to humanity. The good they do is inconceivable....
Hi Jea,
I am not aware of any heat treatment to do what you are suggesting that they do to Banana Shallots.
If you have read anything with regards to a likely treatment I would be most obliged for your source of information.
I am not aware of any heat treatment to do what you are suggesting that they do to Banana Shallots.
If you have read anything with regards to a likely treatment I would be most obliged for your source of information.
JB.