Fiends of the earth...

[Mr Potato Head]

I would heartily agree with you in principle, and certainly, everything that I grow is grown organically!

However, I suspect that not everyone in the world shares our upstanding views and would happily plaster the word 'organic' all over their poison-soaked products... much in the same way that the tw*t with 'plumber' on the side of his van 'fixed' my drain so that it forms a nice puddle in front of my house...

If the powers that choose had chosen a different word - let's say 'foobar' - would we have the same strength of opposition to the SA's use of it? Would I now be saying, 'well I try to be as foobar as possible, but I'm not registered'... I suspect I might.

Also, the SA (and the other organisations that are registered authorities) don't have a legal monopoly on the use of the word 'organic' unless it's on a label on food. Which is why I can still have an 'organic' experience when washing my hair and I can still say, quite legitimately, that this website has grown organically, without fear of reprimand. In this case, context is key.

[Carole B.]

Mr Potato Head I can say without fear of contradiction that you are 100% ORGANIC (unless of course you have a pacemaker!)
The thought of you having an organic experience in the shower has quite made my day!

[Allan]

There was an item recently on Farming Today about the 'success' of sales of Organic produce of all sorts. They reckoned an increase of some 30%, then said something about organic fizzy drinks. It doesn't seem to me that they really have anything to do with what is generally classed as organic, carbon dioxide is purely a chemical, albeit an organic one in the true meaning of the word. No wounder they could say that sales have increased if they count that sort of rubbish.
I'll have to look along the shelves and see what other rubbish is included.
The other thing that narks me is the concept that anything 'chemical' is necessarily wrong. Too many people on this forum are accepting this as an assumed fact and it's a lot of rubbish as applied.With pure chemicals, at least you know exactly what you are getting which is more than can be said about just about all the 'natural.' products, so a scientist can tell you exactly what it will do, good or bad, in the majority of cases.I would rather give a foliar feed of Chempak 3, for instance, than organic 'tea', if there was any chance of the product not being washed by the customer.
Allan

[Beccy]

The idea of 'chemical free' cleaning products always makes me smile, although I do wonder how I have missed the development of such small and finely controlled vacuums, at least I assume if these products are chemical free they must be vacuums....

And sorry for not getting back to people on points addressed to me, I am not just ignoring you and will respond soon I hope.

[peter]

There was an item recently on Farming Today about the 'success' of sales of Organic produce of all sorts. They reckoned an increase of some 30%, then said something about organic fizzy drinks. It doesn't seem to me that they really have anything to do with what is generally classed as organic, carbon dioxide is purely a chemical, albeit an organic one in the true meaning of the word. No wounder they could say that sales have increased if they count that sort of rubbish.
I'll have to look along the shelves and see what other rubbish is included.
The other thing that narks me is the concept that anything 'chemical' is necessarily wrong. Too many people on this forum are accepting this as an assumed fact and it's a lot of rubbish as applied.With pure chemicals, at least you know exactly what you are getting which is more than can be said about just about all the 'natural.' products, so a scientist can tell you exactly what it will do, good or bad, in the majority of cases.I would rather give a foliar feed of Chempak 3, for instance, than organic 'tea', if there was any chance of the product not being washed by the customer.
Allan

Oh Allan, I've caught you out on this one I'm afraid.
There is a national shortage of CO2 at the moment, the producers of Magners Irish Cider are having to import it from Poland.
Reason why you ask?
"The crisis was caused by an explosion at one of the UK's biggest CO2-producing plants, based in Billingham, Teesside, which meant production had to be shut down when demand from the soft drinks industry was at its highest.

The factory's parent company, Terra Nitrogen, is still repairing the damage caused by the incident on June 1.

Production was also cut back over the winter because of the high prices of natural gas, a main raw ingredient for the manufacture of ammonia for fertiliser, of which CO2 is a by-product."

Organic, a byproduct of artificial fertilizer production from Natural Gas, and currently accumulating food miles all the way from Poland.

Source http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

[Johnboy]

Hi Carole,
Sob sob!! Does this mean that my Titanium Knee means I fail Organic registration! Oh dear oh dear!!

[retropants]

Eeek, sorry to stick my nose in, but, having spent 12 years as an Analytical Chemist, I think I can stick up for Allan here, I think what Allan means here is 'organic' as in organic chemistry, ie. an organic compound, as is methane etc etc.

Sorry for being an anorak (or if grasped wrong end of stick)!!

[Trevor Holloway]

Although I try to grow "organically" I will admit to liberally spraying all my produce with DiHydrogen Oxide on many an occasion !!!

Whilst on my soapbox, I have a problem with the Quality Assurance bandwagon - just because you are not ISO registered it is usually seen as you are not commited to providing good service or products. You get the ISO mark if you adhere to your own set standards and procedures, along with paying a fee rather than a measure of your product !

Did you know you can now get properly certified organic leather shoes and handbags (I know some-one in the certifying department at DEFRA who told me this) ?

[Beccy]

I have no problems with organic shoes, you should use as much of an animal as possible; if there is organic beef there should be organic leather and leather products. I tend to agree with Allan, however that some of the more processed food products seem to contravene the spirit of the label organic.

[Allan]

Many years ago I went round a yeas factory and one of their most useful byproducts was frozen carbon dioxide, sold not for the gas as such but rather as a convenient freezer. surely there must be lots of other sources of carbon dioxide waiting to be tapped. They can extract gold from sea water, why not carbon dioxide from all sorts of places, or is it the SA ruling these out as not Organic. It seems to me a conflict between organicists and environmentalists, similar to SA ruling out recycled packaging of Organic produce.