Kitchen Garden Forum

My local supermarket (12 miles away) has had biodegradable bags for the last few years. The supermarket is in Wales so at least one small supermarket chain have taken the Welsh Assembly's words to heart.
Even the bags from my local garage come mini-supermarket has biodegradable bags. I think they are made of plasticized Cellulose but not 100% sure. I think they have a life of two years then wherever they are they disintegrate.
Polythene bags are used time and time again here and I have some Morrison's long life bags which I have been using for about four years now and they are still in good condition.
At Morrison's I very seldom see people using Polythene bags as most people have bought the same bags as myself and I think it must be an English thing and in England the response has been so great legislation is not needed!
JB.

But are "biodegradable" bags really the answer, or is the use of the comforting word just another con to salve the conscience of the would-be-eco-self-satisfied?

Some of the unadvertised (i.e. inconvenient) issues are discussed in this article from the Guardian:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/c ... astic-bags

Maybe the answer is not to use any disposable plastic bags, whatever the "reassuring" label they bear.

alan refail wrote:But are "biodegradable" bags really the answer,

Maybe the answer is not to use any disposable plastic bags, whatever the "reassuring" label they bear.

I heartily agree Alan. I think this may also need people to sit back and look at what they do.

Anyone who's been to an outside event over the summer would have seen the "glasses" used in the bars are often proudly displaying a sign showing they are made of corn starch, so are biodegradable. Great - they can be thrown away, no more paying someone to wash up actual glasses.

However it's just another hidden cost. And it does nothing to help reduce our throwaway culture. (end of rant.....)

Hi Colin,
I suspect that you have entirely the wrong aspect on the subject.
Things that are made from corn starch have taken a very long research programme and with such large events as County Shows would you prefer to have Glass, which will inevitably be broken, instead or Polythene which will be underground undegraded in 100 years from now.
It just goes to prove that you cannot please everybody but in this instance I suspect that you are not entirely right. It does appear that we do have a throw away mentality and imagine broken glass as a health hazard to animals that normally graze such area. People who would have to spend hours having to clear up the mess sorting the wheat from the chaff and no doubt receiving cuts. Looking at what you have said I would prefer a clean corn starch glass every time rather than have a "clean" glass that has been shown some water.
It is not the use of Polythene Bags that has caused the problem but the misuse. Misuse by local authorities at land fill sites is one of the biggest problems. I really think you should reconsider your judgement or at least look very closely at both sides of the argument.
JB.

Elderflower wrote:I know what you mean Primrose, and I hope this doesn`t happen.
I do worry though, about the environmental impact of carefully wrapping dog droppings in plastic and sending them to landfill.
There must be a better way.
Newspaper has been recommended as an alternative but it`s a bit fragile.
Dunno - - -

Not easy to carry around as often it can be difficult to find a 'dog' bin

Shallot Man wrote:Why not put a charge on the suppliers for unnecessary packaging.

Wouldn't they just pass on the cost to us anyway?

As already pointed out some plastic is biodegradable so why don't they make more use of that. Our local supermarket sells lose fruit and packaged but people still buy the packaged even though they can't always see exactly what they are buying. Often on close inspection the fruit packed in polystyrene and plastic is mouldy.

We have the reuseable bags too - we bought three large ones which works well for big shops. Both Sainsbury's and Morrisons have their own and I guess the other supermarkets too. They seem to be very popular.

A tax on plastic bags was introduced in Ireland about eight years ago. Prevoiusly tattered bags in hedgerows was a common sight and the tax has stopped this. Everyone now has re-usable bags for shopping and the supermarkets hardly "sell" any plastic bags. Re the dog poo we use small plastic bags off a roll. I must admit that it was strange at first but we soon got used to it. Just like the smoking ban.

Regards, Gerry.

Lots of the plastic wrapping in our hedges is from sheets that are used in shops and industry does the tax cut down on that too?

at one end of the store youve got customers agonising over how many plastic bags theyre using..... meanwhile the supermarket is paying staff to crush perfectly good clean cardboard boxes... which they then pay to have collected by a truck...... are we missing something here.

most of us use the supermarket trolly to take the shopping from the checkout to the car... we park the car outside the door when we get home... why do we need bags in the first place.. a few boxes in the boot of the car to speed unloading at home is all we need.

Hi Richard P, I am sure it wasn't that long ago that supermarkets used to have a corral behind the checkouts where all the cardboard boxes were put for customers to use. They could also be raided by those moving house. I expect some health and safety law led to their removal but it was a much better system in my opinion.

We still get cardboard boxes from our supermarket - they are stacked so you can help yourself - we use lots of them for storing vegetables

We do, too, GL, particularly the apple boxes which are brill for storing potatoes in single or double layers. Those boxes come from Tescos.

For ordinary shopping we use the re-usable bags which last for years and also some canvas ones which will see our lifetime out, I think.

Only a day to go for the free plastic bag

http://www.carrierbagchargewales.gov.uk ... =1&lang=en

Gerry wrote:A tax on plastic bags was introduced in Ireland about eight years ago. Prevoiusly tattered bags in hedgerows was a common sight and the tax has stopped this. Everyone now has re-usable bags for shopping and the supermarkets hardly "sell" any plastic bags. Re the dog poo we use small plastic bags off a roll. I must admit that it was strange at first but we soon got used to it. Just like the smoking ban.

Regards, Gerry.

Thank you; you beat me to it!

However, there seems to be a loophole at markets as plastic bags are freely in use and not charged for. I am still using the UK ASDA free "bags for life" that I gathered when near the border.

Oh and butchers shops don't charge either and nor do fishmongers and many greengrocers.

Elle's Garden wrote:Hi Richard P, I am sure it wasn't that long ago that supermarkets used to have a corral behind the checkouts where all the cardboard boxes were put for customers to use. They could also be raided by those moving house. I expect some health and safety law led to their removal but it was a much better system in my opinion.

In Ireland shops simply recycle the boxes; but smaller local shops have them and if you go into LIDL at the right time, there are lots of the vegetable trays. They get used for all kinds of storage eg knitting yarn and beads.