Caterpillar epidemic!
Moderators: KG Steve, Chantal, Tigger, peter
Is everybody suffering from the dreaded cabbage white this year? Most people on our allotments have had all their greens stripped bare. I have been picking the little blighters off by hand on my solitary row of winter caulies. The birds do not seem to want to eat them.
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they are trying, but they won't be getting past the enviromesh barrier anytime soon!
- retropants
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yes, my broccoli is as clean as a whistle, and cabbages are not lacey like normal. The only remaining problem has been slugs and snails, but that's a whole other battle!
I am very impressed with the enviromesh, and it was worth every penny. Normally my broccoli is inedible due to caterpillars snoozing inside. I think this has been my best year for brassicas, probably a combination of the mesh, and the rain we have had. Very happy bunny.
don't get me started on bunnies.......
I am very impressed with the enviromesh, and it was worth every penny. Normally my broccoli is inedible due to caterpillars snoozing inside. I think this has been my best year for brassicas, probably a combination of the mesh, and the rain we have had. Very happy bunny.
don't get me started on bunnies.......
Interesting piece on radio 4 this afternoon as I was chopping those bits which could be rescued from the green tomatoes:
Large white caterpillars have the ability to concentrate some chemical from brassicas to a degree that makes them taste unpleasant to birds. Their bright stripes are also classic warning colours and birds do not eat them. This is why you find the damn things munching in full view on the tops of the leaves.
The small whites have green caterpillars that taste just fine and hide underneath the leaves.
I think the small whites also have more conspicuous eggs so they are easier to blitz at an earlier stage.
Our broccoli got rabbited when they discovered that they could get through the barn at one point (gap in defences now closed) so the caterpillars haven't bothered with the remains. But the rabbits totally ignored red cabbage, Falstaff sprouts (reddish colour) and Cavolo nero so the large whites had a go at those.
Can't think of many things that make you feel better than jumping on caterpillars!
Large white caterpillars have the ability to concentrate some chemical from brassicas to a degree that makes them taste unpleasant to birds. Their bright stripes are also classic warning colours and birds do not eat them. This is why you find the damn things munching in full view on the tops of the leaves.
The small whites have green caterpillars that taste just fine and hide underneath the leaves.
I think the small whites also have more conspicuous eggs so they are easier to blitz at an earlier stage.
Our broccoli got rabbited when they discovered that they could get through the barn at one point (gap in defences now closed) so the caterpillars haven't bothered with the remains. But the rabbits totally ignored red cabbage, Falstaff sprouts (reddish colour) and Cavolo nero so the large whites had a go at those.
Can't think of many things that make you feel better than jumping on caterpillars!
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I have also suffered with the caterpillars this year. I haven't used fleece because when I did 2 years ago I lost virtually all of my sprouting broccoli to ring spot - the more humid conditions underneath seemed to encourage that, I didn't realise in time and it easn't as easy to pick of the dead or dying leaves with the fleece in place. So I have been picking them off - twice daily - EXCEPT on the Swedes, which is most strange.
In other years Swedes have also suffered badly, but they seem to be untouched. They are in a short row planted between a row of beetroot on one side and parsnips on the other and I am wondering if one or the other is deterring the cabbage whites? The Swedes are enormous and the first one picked has the 2 of us a week.
As for caterpillar protection, I think I am going for a vegetable cage with anti-butterfly netting next year. And that was the other thing I found with fleece - the butterflies sometimes go inside! Hopefully the cage and netting will be more secure.
In other years Swedes have also suffered badly, but they seem to be untouched. They are in a short row planted between a row of beetroot on one side and parsnips on the other and I am wondering if one or the other is deterring the cabbage whites? The Swedes are enormous and the first one picked has the 2 of us a week.
As for caterpillar protection, I think I am going for a vegetable cage with anti-butterfly netting next year. And that was the other thing I found with fleece - the butterflies sometimes go inside! Hopefully the cage and netting will be more secure.
Hi Heyjude,
I listened to the same programme and had already read what they were explaining some years ago.
It is only the Large Whites that are able to apply this immunity the Small Whites do not.
This is where those who garden 'Natures Way' come unstuck. Those who pick the caterpillars off again generally come unstuck because they cannot pick them off in time for an awful lot of damage being done.
The pragmatic way is to use nets and if you invest in Environmesh you will also exclude the Cabbage Root Fly. Having the brassicas within a net cage it then means that slug pellets can be used without upsetting anything but the target.
As Colin points out Fleece covering fails to give good ventilation which is absolutely essential and all manner of ill can befall your crop without a good flow of air. Certainly fleeces are useful for protection but not on a permanent basis. If used, fleeces are best lifted above the crop which tends to allow for better ventilation.
What must be remembered is that for every caterpillar that you miss has the possibility of giving you a couple of hundred next year.
Pragmatic means common sense and it is surely common sense to use nets.
JB.
I listened to the same programme and had already read what they were explaining some years ago.
It is only the Large Whites that are able to apply this immunity the Small Whites do not.
This is where those who garden 'Natures Way' come unstuck. Those who pick the caterpillars off again generally come unstuck because they cannot pick them off in time for an awful lot of damage being done.
The pragmatic way is to use nets and if you invest in Environmesh you will also exclude the Cabbage Root Fly. Having the brassicas within a net cage it then means that slug pellets can be used without upsetting anything but the target.
As Colin points out Fleece covering fails to give good ventilation which is absolutely essential and all manner of ill can befall your crop without a good flow of air. Certainly fleeces are useful for protection but not on a permanent basis. If used, fleeces are best lifted above the crop which tends to allow for better ventilation.
What must be remembered is that for every caterpillar that you miss has the possibility of giving you a couple of hundred next year.
Pragmatic means common sense and it is surely common sense to use nets.
JB.
These meshes are so expensive. I like to grow veg, but my main reason is to help the weekly budget, using these meshes defeats the object, how is it justified ? I only grow spring cabbage, I have just planted mine out now that the butterflies have gone, & I stand to get a crop in spring before they become a real problem.
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Does anything other than spiders, eat any butterflies, white or coloured ?
I have never seen any bird picking them off, even though they just float!
I have never seen any bird picking them off, even though they just float!
Buy land, they do not make it anymore!
Hi Gloworm,
Yes meshes are expensive! Meshes are not just for one year and if you manage to use those nets for ten years and spread the cost then they are quite cheap considering the increase of yield of crop that you will achieve. Your saving comes in better quality produce and more of it. BUT first you must buy your net! Go on be a devil!
JB.
Yes meshes are expensive! Meshes are not just for one year and if you manage to use those nets for ten years and spread the cost then they are quite cheap considering the increase of yield of crop that you will achieve. Your saving comes in better quality produce and more of it. BUT first you must buy your net! Go on be a devil!
JB.
Hi Gloworm,
I certainly do use anti butterfly netting and also anti bird netting for my soft fruit and anti white fly netting for many applications especially carrots.
Not against white fly but carrot root fly.
I feel that if you were to use Environmesh, which you can buy in small quantities, would be of great assistance to you.
JB.
I certainly do use anti butterfly netting and also anti bird netting for my soft fruit and anti white fly netting for many applications especially carrots.
Not against white fly but carrot root fly.
I feel that if you were to use Environmesh, which you can buy in small quantities, would be of great assistance to you.
JB.