nothing to do with gardening, but tidal power was mentioned on another thread, the french had a tidal power generator somewhere near ST Malo some forty years ago, does anyone know if its still working? or what happened to it?
When we were in the Algarve 4 or 5 years ago we came accross a small portugese set up that in the past used a tidal basin to power several corn mills.
tidal power
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Hi Richard,
I believe that the whole tidal area of the river Severn is under review but as usual is subject to somebody's approval and then public meetings abound.
There is a total lack of government intervention which at times is needed. Mr Brown prefers to stick 2p per litre on Diesel and bury his head in the sand.
As far as I can see the government calls for less use of fossil fuel to be used to combat global warming but simply cannot make a decision as what to do for the best. In the meantime not a lot gets done.
JB.
I believe that the whole tidal area of the river Severn is under review but as usual is subject to somebody's approval and then public meetings abound.
There is a total lack of government intervention which at times is needed. Mr Brown prefers to stick 2p per litre on Diesel and bury his head in the sand.
As far as I can see the government calls for less use of fossil fuel to be used to combat global warming but simply cannot make a decision as what to do for the best. In the meantime not a lot gets done.
JB.
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Chantal
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Do these links help? It appears the St Malo generator is still working after 37 years.
http://www.tidalelectric.com/History.htm
http://www.theecologist.org/archive_det ... ent_id=365
http://www.tidalelectric.com/History.htm
http://www.theecologist.org/archive_det ... ent_id=365
Chantal
I know this corner of the earth, it smiles for me...
I know this corner of the earth, it smiles for me...
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Cider Boys
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Hello Johnboy
You are certainly correct in saying our government does nothing about an impending energy crisis. Like many things they only ‘talk the talk’. However, this is totally by their own making. Historically New Labour has been with the Green lobby in attacking Nuclear power. Now they are faced with a dilemma that, in reality there is only one option, to build nuclear power plants, but have erroneously conditioned the layman ‘Joe Public’ to fear anything nuclear.
I live near two nuclear plants, Hinkey A and B, and years ago permission was granted to build a third Hinkey C but our government knew better. It thought a couple of wind farms would guarantee our energy needs, what a farce!
Generating power from the tides was first proposed on the Severn hundreds of years ago.The modern proposals still refer to the Severn but of course the barrage would be cited miles away in the Bristol Channel from Brean Down in Somerset to Lavernock Point near Cardiff. Like many ideas it sounds good but is unlikely to be built because it is not proven and would be highly costly.
We need a solution now unless we wish to rely on other countries’ supplying us their energy. France experimented with water turbines but are now 76% Nuclear, Finland have also seen the light are at present 27% nuclear and planning to increase this, the USA are also going to build more nuclear power plants. Unless opponents can point to a proven way to generate electrical power for the 21st century, with no carbon emissions, they should remain dreaming and let nuclear power solve an impending crisis.
All the best
Barney
You are certainly correct in saying our government does nothing about an impending energy crisis. Like many things they only ‘talk the talk’. However, this is totally by their own making. Historically New Labour has been with the Green lobby in attacking Nuclear power. Now they are faced with a dilemma that, in reality there is only one option, to build nuclear power plants, but have erroneously conditioned the layman ‘Joe Public’ to fear anything nuclear.
I live near two nuclear plants, Hinkey A and B, and years ago permission was granted to build a third Hinkey C but our government knew better. It thought a couple of wind farms would guarantee our energy needs, what a farce!
Generating power from the tides was first proposed on the Severn hundreds of years ago.The modern proposals still refer to the Severn but of course the barrage would be cited miles away in the Bristol Channel from Brean Down in Somerset to Lavernock Point near Cardiff. Like many ideas it sounds good but is unlikely to be built because it is not proven and would be highly costly.
We need a solution now unless we wish to rely on other countries’ supplying us their energy. France experimented with water turbines but are now 76% Nuclear, Finland have also seen the light are at present 27% nuclear and planning to increase this, the USA are also going to build more nuclear power plants. Unless opponents can point to a proven way to generate electrical power for the 21st century, with no carbon emissions, they should remain dreaming and let nuclear power solve an impending crisis.
All the best
Barney
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madasafish
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There is another alternative: home generation - from a variety of means - solar, water and wind. In many other countries it makes economic sense because you can sell surplus power which is not used to the Local Electricity Company. In the UK, however, whilst you can do this, the price you get is - unlike most other countries, set at a level which makes it uneconomic!!!!!
So it does not happen...here.
Meanwhile John Prescott flew round the world several times to conferences on global warming - so that's all right then.
Absolute hypocrisy...and totally incompetent.
Sorry rant over...
So it does not happen...here.
Meanwhile John Prescott flew round the world several times to conferences on global warming - so that's all right then.
Absolute hypocrisy...and totally incompetent.
Sorry rant over...
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Cider Boys
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Hello Madasafish
If only it were true; do you really think our country could be served by home generation? I would be interested in the facts to back that up. Would you be happy to lay on an operating table at your local hospital with windmills and solar panels supplying the electricity. I’m afraid you have been misled by the government when they turned their backs on nuclear power.
As for John Prescott, is this same John Prescott when New Labour came to power was regularly on Radio 4 telling us he would get us all out of our cars and into public transport? What’s happened then, completely nothing. The facts are the car is here to stay, public transport is an expensive national disgrace and now they want to tax us because global warming is our fault!
Barney
If only it were true; do you really think our country could be served by home generation? I would be interested in the facts to back that up. Would you be happy to lay on an operating table at your local hospital with windmills and solar panels supplying the electricity. I’m afraid you have been misled by the government when they turned their backs on nuclear power.
As for John Prescott, is this same John Prescott when New Labour came to power was regularly on Radio 4 telling us he would get us all out of our cars and into public transport? What’s happened then, completely nothing. The facts are the car is here to stay, public transport is an expensive national disgrace and now they want to tax us because global warming is our fault!
Barney
hi barney, fraid ive got to dissagree with you on nucleur, if we forget accidents, we still havn't solved the problem of what to do with the waste, how do you dispose of a nuc station when its reached the end of its useful life?
going back to tidal ive now looked on google apparently the barrage on the Rance is still producing electricity , has paid back its capital cost and running costs per kwh produced are less than that of nucleur. and the place gets 200000 tourists a year
i think the environment and bird lobbies have killed the idea of a severn barrage, but latest ideas seem to be leaning towards turbines on the sea bed rather like an underwater wind farm.
the biggest problem in this country is the ammount of tax on road fuel, if we all reduced our petrol usage by 50% the country would go bust in a week
so despite the words very little is being done by the government
going back to tidal ive now looked on google apparently the barrage on the Rance is still producing electricity , has paid back its capital cost and running costs per kwh produced are less than that of nucleur. and the place gets 200000 tourists a year
i think the environment and bird lobbies have killed the idea of a severn barrage, but latest ideas seem to be leaning towards turbines on the sea bed rather like an underwater wind farm.
the biggest problem in this country is the ammount of tax on road fuel, if we all reduced our petrol usage by 50% the country would go bust in a week
so despite the words very little is being done by the government-
Cider Boys
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Hello Richard
You are absolutely correct in that disposing of the waste is a problem to be solved. I am also keen on any green alternative to producing energy but the facts are plain, there are none at present. So the government has to make a decision, if it does not build nuclear plants, do we rely on buying other countries energy that we have no control over or do we start building modern coal powered stations again using British mined coal. Incidentally far more people have lost their lives due to coal mining than have ever been lost due to nuclear power generation.
People criticise nuclear power but give no practical alternative. Building the nuclear plants does not prevent research into other alternatives or more research into the disposal of nuclear waste. As I have stated before, people of this country have been conditioned to fear anything nuclear. However do we also critisise our NHS hospitals that are developing and practising nuclear medicine? I hope not.
I do hope a rationale debate takes place in the country based on facts and not conditioned prejudice before it is too late.
All the best
Barney
You are absolutely correct in that disposing of the waste is a problem to be solved. I am also keen on any green alternative to producing energy but the facts are plain, there are none at present. So the government has to make a decision, if it does not build nuclear plants, do we rely on buying other countries energy that we have no control over or do we start building modern coal powered stations again using British mined coal. Incidentally far more people have lost their lives due to coal mining than have ever been lost due to nuclear power generation.
People criticise nuclear power but give no practical alternative. Building the nuclear plants does not prevent research into other alternatives or more research into the disposal of nuclear waste. As I have stated before, people of this country have been conditioned to fear anything nuclear. However do we also critisise our NHS hospitals that are developing and practising nuclear medicine? I hope not.
I do hope a rationale debate takes place in the country based on facts and not conditioned prejudice before it is too late.
All the best
Barney
Here is that website on tidal npower to which I referred.
http://www.marineturbines.com/home.htm
Allan
http://www.marineturbines.com/home.htm
Allan
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peter
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As I understand the barrage principle, you let tidal flow in, generating a certain amount of electricity, then shut the gates at high tide and let the whole lot out slowly generating rather more electricity.
Three problems.
Navigation is compromised, you have to build locks as big as the biggest ship that needs to pass. (Would that affect BAE Filton)
The tidal mudflats and marshes do not get their wet and dry mix as before with an impact on the ecosystem, waders and migratory birds.
The area behind the barrage tends to silt up much quicker than it did before the barrage was constructed, less water volume, less power...
A final point, how much power is used to create all the concrete and steel used to construct such an edifice, what is the structures lifetime, and how long is the power/carbon payback period.
Three problems.
Navigation is compromised, you have to build locks as big as the biggest ship that needs to pass. (Would that affect BAE Filton)
The tidal mudflats and marshes do not get their wet and dry mix as before with an impact on the ecosystem, waders and migratory birds.
The area behind the barrage tends to silt up much quicker than it did before the barrage was constructed, less water volume, less power...
A final point, how much power is used to create all the concrete and steel used to construct such an edifice, what is the structures lifetime, and how long is the power/carbon payback period.
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so the conclusion is dont upset a few birds by building a tidal barrage accross the Bristol channel but build a another nucleur plant at hinkley point which may or may not slowly poison the birds or raise the water temp etc and if it goes pear shaped will wipe out Bristol aswell as the birds
sorry its been a one of them days and im off to bed
sorry its been a one of them days and im off to bed
Hi Barney,
Sadly your last sentence is exactly what is happening.
Those who are anti nuclear are not taking into account the strides taken forward and all manage to be twenty years behind in their approach. Although disposal of waste is the main problem really Nuclear is the cleanest enviromentally speaking. Nuclear waste from the more modern reactors are still a problem but not to the same extent as the first reactors.
I understand that France uses mainly Nuclear Power for their supply of electricity and it only seems here in UK these complications are supposed to be so dire. Why?
JB.
Sadly your last sentence is exactly what is happening.
Those who are anti nuclear are not taking into account the strides taken forward and all manage to be twenty years behind in their approach. Although disposal of waste is the main problem really Nuclear is the cleanest enviromentally speaking. Nuclear waste from the more modern reactors are still a problem but not to the same extent as the first reactors.
I understand that France uses mainly Nuclear Power for their supply of electricity and it only seems here in UK these complications are supposed to be so dire. Why?
JB.