What is so wonderful about this thread is that whereas Home Made Bread was rather a thing of the past it is now up and thriving.
Making bread was for years looked upon as a 'chore' and ready made bread has been so easy to obtain but it seems that the peasants have revolted at the quality of that offered for sale.
I think this great revival is due to the introduction of the bread making machines and if for no other point they must be praised.
I have never looked upon making bread as a chore and in fact I really like it because I somehow find it thereaputic. It really takes up very little time if you are organized. Somehow when I take my bread out of the oven I have a personal sense of achievement.
I have Arthritis in my hands and my wrists have started to turn in and I find that kneading may at times be painful it somehow helps as a kind of physiotherapy.
Postings about different types of bread and the recipes are terrific keep them coming!
Bread maker
Moderators: KG Steve, Chantal, Tigger, peter
Hi all
This is a great thread!!! I've been toying about buying a bread maker for a while and they have them on special offer here at the moment for about £30 for a large one.
I usually make my bread the old fashioned way but i would try a machine as well. You might have convinced me to go and invest.
This is a great thread!!! I've been toying about buying a bread maker for a while and they have them on special offer here at the moment for about £30 for a large one.
I usually make my bread the old fashioned way but i would try a machine as well. You might have convinced me to go and invest.
Lots of love
Lizzie
Lizzie
This has been an excellent thread. Many thanks to Carole for getting it started.
I like to try different flour mixes and would recommend these three for some different loaves. Using your recipe and method for a basic white loaf (a good quality bread flour needed), substitute:
— 1/3 of the flour with rye flour;
— 1/2 of the flour with spelt flour;
— 1/5 of the flour with quinoa flour.
John
I like to try different flour mixes and would recommend these three for some different loaves. Using your recipe and method for a basic white loaf (a good quality bread flour needed), substitute:
— 1/3 of the flour with rye flour;
— 1/2 of the flour with spelt flour;
— 1/5 of the flour with quinoa flour.
John
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Guest
Silly Question time.
Bread makers have a paddle in the bottom to mix the mix. Don't you get a big hole in the bottom loaf
Bread makers have a paddle in the bottom to mix the mix. Don't you get a big hole in the bottom loaf
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valmarg
I think I may have been a bit over the top on saying that I consider breadmakers to be overrated.
Never having possessed one, I am not qualified to judge their usefulness.
One thing I am sure of is that, whatever method is used in the home, whether it be conventional or breadmaker method, it sure as hell, tastewise, beats the crap out of the pappy sliced bread (white or brown).
I agree with (I think it was johnboy), the fact that we are taking the trouble to make our own bread, by whatever method, should send a signal to the supermarkets that what they are providing is not what WE the great british public want.
I would have to admit that, as much as we prefer our own bread, unfortunately we are not going to make much of a dent in the white pappy crappy sliced market.
One of the most satisfying aspects of baking your own bread is the WONDERFUL smell.
Whatever method you use, it has got to be much, much better than the pap they sell in supermarkets.
Happy growing and sowing 2006, and also a brilliant baking year.
Love and kisses
valmarg
Never having possessed one, I am not qualified to judge their usefulness.
One thing I am sure of is that, whatever method is used in the home, whether it be conventional or breadmaker method, it sure as hell, tastewise, beats the crap out of the pappy sliced bread (white or brown).
I agree with (I think it was johnboy), the fact that we are taking the trouble to make our own bread, by whatever method, should send a signal to the supermarkets that what they are providing is not what WE the great british public want.
I would have to admit that, as much as we prefer our own bread, unfortunately we are not going to make much of a dent in the white pappy crappy sliced market.
One of the most satisfying aspects of baking your own bread is the WONDERFUL smell.
Whatever method you use, it has got to be much, much better than the pap they sell in supermarkets.
Happy growing and sowing 2006, and also a brilliant baking year.
Love and kisses
valmarg
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Guest
Hi,
The paddle in my Panasonic isn't too big, but yes, you get a hole (you'll note the blade is as thin as possible to do the job). Hint: Be careful to notice when you remove the loaf from the pan whether the paddle stays in the pan or disappears in the bottom of a loaf - I learned the hard way, and tried to cut through the Teflon-coated paddle and scratched it and dulled my knife blade too. Only did it once! I'm guessing that engineers on the better breadmakers have determined how to minimise the paddle but still knead the bread!
The paddle in my Panasonic isn't too big, but yes, you get a hole (you'll note the blade is as thin as possible to do the job). Hint: Be careful to notice when you remove the loaf from the pan whether the paddle stays in the pan or disappears in the bottom of a loaf - I learned the hard way, and tried to cut through the Teflon-coated paddle and scratched it and dulled my knife blade too. Only did it once! I'm guessing that engineers on the better breadmakers have determined how to minimise the paddle but still knead the bread!
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Jenny Green
- KG Regular
- Posts: 1139
- Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 4:47 pm
- Location: East Midlands
My breadmaker's paddle is attached to the pan. I can't see why other manufacturers don't do this. It makes life much easier. Yes, you get a paddle shaped hole but it doesn't make any difference to the eating experience (except you can't pass your bread off as hand made!).
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valmarg
Hi nog,
This recipe is easy, and works for me:
1/2 oz fresh yeast
scant 1/2 pint lukewarm milk
1 teaspoon caster sugar
1lb strong plain flour
2 teaspoons salt
1 oz butter
1 egg lightly beaten
beaten egg to glaze
1. Dissolve the yeast with a little of the milk and the sugar in a teacup.
2 Sift the flour with the salt into a large mixing bowl and rub in the butter as you would for pastry.
3. Pour in the yeast mixture, the remaining milk and the beaten egg and mix to a softish dough.
4. Add a small amount of flour to the dough if it is too sticky. When the dough will leave the sides of the bowl press it into a ball and tip out on to a floured work surface.
5. Knead until it is elastic, smooth and shiny. (About 10 minutes).
6. Lightly oil a large bowl, put the dough into the bowl, turn it over so that it is lightly covered with oil, then cover the bowl with clingfilm. (Sunflower oil is best for oiling the bowl.)
7. Put the bowl in a warm place and leave it to rise until it has doubled in size (at least an hour).
8. Knock back and knead for a further 10 minutes or so.
9. Shape the dough into an oblong and put it into a 2lb loaf tin.
10. Cover again with a damp teatowel and prove (allow to rise again) until it is the size and shape of a loaf. Brush with beaten egg. (I can add from experience here, do not use an egg straight from the fridge. It will knock the dough back again, may not rise again!)
11. Preheat the oven to 220C/425F/gas mark 5. Bake the loaf in the oven for 10 minutes, then turn the oven temperature down to 190C/375F/gas mark 5, and bake for a further 25 minutes, or until it is golden and firm.
12. Turn the loaf out on to a wire rack to cool. It should sound hollow when tapped on the underside. If it does not, or feels squashy and heavy, return it to the oven, without the tin, for a further
c. 10 minutes.
If you have a food mixer it makes the initial kneading much easier, but if you have not then it is a good way to relieve the pent up frustrations.
It is basically trial and error, the more you bake the more you get to feel when the dough is 'elastic, smooth and shiny'. I find when you do not need any more flour and when you knead the dough it doesn't stick to the work surface.
It looks complicated, but it isn't really, and the end product will taste better than anything you can buy.
Happy baking,
valmarg
This recipe is easy, and works for me:
1/2 oz fresh yeast
scant 1/2 pint lukewarm milk
1 teaspoon caster sugar
1lb strong plain flour
2 teaspoons salt
1 oz butter
1 egg lightly beaten
beaten egg to glaze
1. Dissolve the yeast with a little of the milk and the sugar in a teacup.
2 Sift the flour with the salt into a large mixing bowl and rub in the butter as you would for pastry.
3. Pour in the yeast mixture, the remaining milk and the beaten egg and mix to a softish dough.
4. Add a small amount of flour to the dough if it is too sticky. When the dough will leave the sides of the bowl press it into a ball and tip out on to a floured work surface.
5. Knead until it is elastic, smooth and shiny. (About 10 minutes).
6. Lightly oil a large bowl, put the dough into the bowl, turn it over so that it is lightly covered with oil, then cover the bowl with clingfilm. (Sunflower oil is best for oiling the bowl.)
7. Put the bowl in a warm place and leave it to rise until it has doubled in size (at least an hour).
8. Knock back and knead for a further 10 minutes or so.
9. Shape the dough into an oblong and put it into a 2lb loaf tin.
10. Cover again with a damp teatowel and prove (allow to rise again) until it is the size and shape of a loaf. Brush with beaten egg. (I can add from experience here, do not use an egg straight from the fridge. It will knock the dough back again, may not rise again!)
11. Preheat the oven to 220C/425F/gas mark 5. Bake the loaf in the oven for 10 minutes, then turn the oven temperature down to 190C/375F/gas mark 5, and bake for a further 25 minutes, or until it is golden and firm.
12. Turn the loaf out on to a wire rack to cool. It should sound hollow when tapped on the underside. If it does not, or feels squashy and heavy, return it to the oven, without the tin, for a further
c. 10 minutes.
If you have a food mixer it makes the initial kneading much easier, but if you have not then it is a good way to relieve the pent up frustrations.
It is basically trial and error, the more you bake the more you get to feel when the dough is 'elastic, smooth and shiny'. I find when you do not need any more flour and when you knead the dough it doesn't stick to the work surface.
It looks complicated, but it isn't really, and the end product will taste better than anything you can buy.
Happy baking,
valmarg
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valmarg
Well, yes nog,
As John Denver wrote (and it could apply to breadmaking) "some days are diamonds, some days are stone", and by the description of your last loaf it was a stone.
You get to know what is 'a good bread for you'. There are plenty of recipe books out there. The one I mentioned on a previous thread was 'The Bread Book' by Linda Collister and Anthony Blake,
ISBN 1-85029-532-8.
In this book it gives details of converting from fresh yeast to dried yeast to easiblend yeast.
Also, some of the bread recipes are fantastic.
Persevere, persevere, is the best messege I can give.
Believe me, it is worth the effort.
Love and kisses,
valmarg
As John Denver wrote (and it could apply to breadmaking) "some days are diamonds, some days are stone", and by the description of your last loaf it was a stone.
You get to know what is 'a good bread for you'. There are plenty of recipe books out there. The one I mentioned on a previous thread was 'The Bread Book' by Linda Collister and Anthony Blake,
ISBN 1-85029-532-8.
In this book it gives details of converting from fresh yeast to dried yeast to easiblend yeast.
Also, some of the bread recipes are fantastic.
Persevere, persevere, is the best messege I can give.
Believe me, it is worth the effort.
Love and kisses,
valmarg
Some points for Nog to bear in mind in the quest for great homemade bread. Sorry it's so long, just trying to be helpful (me obsessive?).
Yeast - the different types require different treatment. Reactivate fresh yeast at around 38 degrees centigrade, ie blood heat, the temperature of your little finger. Reactivate active dried yeast at 41-43 degrees C, a little hotter than your little finger, but you should be able to keep it in the water for a count of ten with out it actually burning. This difference explains why a lot of writers are sniffy about dried yeast, if you treat it the same as fresh it just does not work as well. You don't actually need to add any suger to reactivate either type.
Flour - it is surprising how much these vary from brand to brand, but go on trying different ones until you find one that suits you. I like Shipton Mill flours myself. Stoneground is usually better, especially for wholemeals, as the grinding process is colder, so the fat in the wholegrain does not go rancid so quickly. Using a percentage of non-wheat flour makes some of my favourite breads, particularly oatmeal or barley flour. Also try adding flakes as in jumbo oats, barley or wheat flakes.
Liquids - the amount of liquid you need will vary from batch to batch according to things like the type of flour, the temperature, the humidity; learn to recognize the texture of the dough when it produces the kind of bread you like. Generally the more liquid you add the looser the final crumb, I suspect you didn't add enough to your 'bricks'. You need less for white breads and more the less white, or more wholemeal, the flour is. The type of liquid will affect the crust, eg. milk produces a soft crust If yoo like really crisp crusts spray the bread a couple of times while it's in the oven with a water spray.
It is not necessary to add any fat, but worth exploring the different kinds. My walnut bread made with walnut oil and Shipton Mills' Three malts and Sunflower Seed flour (as well as walnuts!) is better than any other I or any of my friends have ever tasted - that's what they say.
For a really well flavoured loaf let the bread rise more than once before you shape it. Each subsequent rising will take longer, I often do two risings, shape the loaves and leave them overnight, baking them sometime the next day. Or keep back some of the dough, mush it up in the warm water and add it to the next lot of bread you make, if you leave it for several days before doing this you will get sour-dough flavours. Dough will rise at different speeds according to what temperature it is kept at, it doesn't need to be warm, you can even rise it in the fridge overnight. In winter I usually rise mine at around 15 degrees C, the temperature of our main room (suits us, we do warm it up a bit for guests). If you rise the bread quickly it will not have time to develop a good flavour, my main qualm a bout bread makers. I use a water spray to stop the top of the dough drying out too much, I find it easier and less messy than faffing about with oil and clingfilm. And if a crust does form spray it and leave for a few minutes, it will absorb the water and soften up.
Warning Once you get making bread under your skin and into your routine it is very difficult to get the boughten kind. I haven't been able to buy bread for the last fifteen years!
Yeast - the different types require different treatment. Reactivate fresh yeast at around 38 degrees centigrade, ie blood heat, the temperature of your little finger. Reactivate active dried yeast at 41-43 degrees C, a little hotter than your little finger, but you should be able to keep it in the water for a count of ten with out it actually burning. This difference explains why a lot of writers are sniffy about dried yeast, if you treat it the same as fresh it just does not work as well. You don't actually need to add any suger to reactivate either type.
Flour - it is surprising how much these vary from brand to brand, but go on trying different ones until you find one that suits you. I like Shipton Mill flours myself. Stoneground is usually better, especially for wholemeals, as the grinding process is colder, so the fat in the wholegrain does not go rancid so quickly. Using a percentage of non-wheat flour makes some of my favourite breads, particularly oatmeal or barley flour. Also try adding flakes as in jumbo oats, barley or wheat flakes.
Liquids - the amount of liquid you need will vary from batch to batch according to things like the type of flour, the temperature, the humidity; learn to recognize the texture of the dough when it produces the kind of bread you like. Generally the more liquid you add the looser the final crumb, I suspect you didn't add enough to your 'bricks'. You need less for white breads and more the less white, or more wholemeal, the flour is. The type of liquid will affect the crust, eg. milk produces a soft crust If yoo like really crisp crusts spray the bread a couple of times while it's in the oven with a water spray.
It is not necessary to add any fat, but worth exploring the different kinds. My walnut bread made with walnut oil and Shipton Mills' Three malts and Sunflower Seed flour (as well as walnuts!) is better than any other I or any of my friends have ever tasted - that's what they say.
For a really well flavoured loaf let the bread rise more than once before you shape it. Each subsequent rising will take longer, I often do two risings, shape the loaves and leave them overnight, baking them sometime the next day. Or keep back some of the dough, mush it up in the warm water and add it to the next lot of bread you make, if you leave it for several days before doing this you will get sour-dough flavours. Dough will rise at different speeds according to what temperature it is kept at, it doesn't need to be warm, you can even rise it in the fridge overnight. In winter I usually rise mine at around 15 degrees C, the temperature of our main room (suits us, we do warm it up a bit for guests). If you rise the bread quickly it will not have time to develop a good flavour, my main qualm a bout bread makers. I use a water spray to stop the top of the dough drying out too much, I find it easier and less messy than faffing about with oil and clingfilm. And if a crust does form spray it and leave for a few minutes, it will absorb the water and soften up.
Warning Once you get making bread under your skin and into your routine it is very difficult to get the boughten kind. I haven't been able to buy bread for the last fifteen years!
Wow Beccy! Thanks for that posting - one of the best that I've seen on forum in a very long time.
This topic rolls on and on.
Can I ask if you've ever tried to make the sourdough types of bread? Are they really as good as the recipes suggest? They seem rather more work and I wondered if the results are worth it.
John
PS I agree with you about the Shipton flours. They are excellent if a bit expensive. I'd also recommend Marriage's 100% Canadian wheat flours.
This topic rolls on and on.
Can I ask if you've ever tried to make the sourdough types of bread? Are they really as good as the recipes suggest? They seem rather more work and I wondered if the results are worth it.
John
PS I agree with you about the Shipton flours. They are excellent if a bit expensive. I'd also recommend Marriage's 100% Canadian wheat flours.
Last edited by John on Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thank you for that, it's always good to know someone finds the stuff you type in useful.
Yes, I have done sourdough bread from scratch. Yes, in some ways it is a faff, although of course it's like normal bread making in that although the whole process takes a long time, the actual amount of time you spend doing things isn't very long at all. And for me, no, it's not worth it, but then I don't really like that type of bread in the first place! I do make it occassionally for my OH and a couple of friends who love that kind of bread.
I've never seen Marriage's flours, I'll look out for them. Although as I've just taken delivery of a 32kg sack of Shiptons wholemeal, and am about to order a 32kg sack of their white perhaps not soon.
Yes, I have done sourdough bread from scratch. Yes, in some ways it is a faff, although of course it's like normal bread making in that although the whole process takes a long time, the actual amount of time you spend doing things isn't very long at all. And for me, no, it's not worth it, but then I don't really like that type of bread in the first place! I do make it occassionally for my OH and a couple of friends who love that kind of bread.
I've never seen Marriage's flours, I'll look out for them. Although as I've just taken delivery of a 32kg sack of Shiptons wholemeal, and am about to order a 32kg sack of their white perhaps not soon.