Tomatoes

[Myrkk]

Hi Guys,
Looking for some advice on growing tomatoes, cordon and bush. I have good success in growing them to a reasonable size. But with the cordons I rarely get many tomatoes. I've tried growing them in a greenhouse and outside. I water them from a plantpot sunk next to them and feed them once a week with tomato fertiliser once they've started to set fruit but still a low yield. Only allow them 4 or 5 trussed before I pinch the top out and make sure I nip the extra bits that grow between the leaves and stalks out as soon as I see them. I've also tried many varieties, the ones I had the best result with was a beefsteak variety which black stripes on it (can't remember the name)

With the bush tomatoes I have even less success. I'm gutted as my Grandpa used to make it look so easy and I used to spend ages helping him, was hoping some of his green fingeredness might have rubbed off.

Any suggestions would be gratefully received.

[Kleftiwallah]

Four to five trusses isn't that bad. You're not comparing home grown tom's to those twelve foot tall monsters shown in the glass acres of a professional grower are you ?

You could try laying the stem along the ground while it is still flexible to the first truss and then tiying it to the cane and sending it up. That way you have more 'productive stem'. You could try not nipping out the top. Cheers, Tony.

[Colin Miles]

If you restrict the small-fruited varieties like Gardeners Delight to 4 or 5 trusses you certainly won't get many. I don't usually restrict them, whether indoors or out and it is mainly a matter of supporting them and making sure that they don't get too crowded. Varieties like Tropical Ruby will go on an on if grown as bushes.

[Nature's Babe]

Give them some rootgrow when you plant the seedlings within 3-4 weeks they have extra root support and protection from the symbiotic fungi. Also mix in some water retaining gel if your compost usually dries out quickly, hot so vital if you are using your own home made compost with plenty of moisture holding capacity!

[alan refail]

I grow all my tomatoes now under cover - polytunnel. I never pinch out the tops to restrict to a certain number of trusses. As Colin said, that's a sure-fire way of reducing yield. If you have space, you can let a couple of side-shoots develop, support them and they will provide an even greater crop.

Grown in good soil/compost tomatoes do not need rootgrow or even weekly feeding - at least mine crop well without either.

[Tony Hague]

Surely the main problems are

1: how many trusses you can get in before the plant hits the roof (setting aside creative training for now)
2: Getting good pollination or set.

I have a fairly modest height greenhouse, and 4-5 trusses is usually all there is space for. Now, one thing you can work on is getting the first truss as low as possible - making sure the plants always have as much light as possible, and planting them deep when potting on/planting out may help. I have mine growing in rings set on a sand bed - a system I like, but I do wonder whether I might gain an extra truss advantage by digging out the floor so that the top of the ring, not the bottom, is at the level of the path.

Getting a good set seems to be the harder problem, our climate often seems to produce two mini-summers - a nice fortnight around Easter and a good late summer with an intervening miserable patch which does not help. Tapping the plants and whatever to shake some pollen around is needed. Bumble bees are supposed to be the best thing, some say an electric toothbrush is a useful substitute !

[John]

Hello Myrrk
One important point that is often overlooked with tomatoes is the need to get a really good strong root system developed on the plant. However much feeding and watering you do if you have a small root system you will never get much of a crop.
Whenever you move young tomato plants on to their next stage eg at pricking out, potting on, try to plant them deeply certainly at least up to the first pair of leaves. They root easily from their buried stems so you can soon get a lot of extra root growth on your plant.
Two excellent bush varieties to try are 'Tumbler' and 'Red Alert'. Tumbler does very well in large pots for me and produces masses of cherry size fruits. Red Alert is best planted in the soil. It tolerates cooler conditions and crops early with medium sized fruits. I put straw under my RAs and grow them like strawberries - the straw seems to help ripening as well as keeping the fruit off the soil. Both have excellent flavour.
I'm a big fan of bush toms - no staking, tying in or pinching out - just let them grow and grow!

John

[Myrkk]

Before I forget.. the cordon variety I'm growing this year is Cossak F1 and the bush is Black Cherry.

Thanks for that advice John. I'll try those varieties next year. The young plants are put into a 3" pot up to their seed leaves when their second set of true leaves are starting to show. They are currently still in those pots at around 7"/9" high. I'm starting to consider putting them into 5" diameter but deep pots, again sinking them deeply, up to their first set of leaves. Once the weather gets better I'll put them into growbags outside.

I don't have a green house this year... long story... involving landscaper, mess and pending court case. However I have got one of those green poly greenhouses which I thought might help with some of the plants I need to have more warmth than outside will provide.

Interesting point re. nipping out, I'll try that this year. What I meant about not getting lots of yield is that even when the trusses are restricted to 4 I get very little fruit on each truss reaching a reasonable size.

With the bushes, I do the exact same (obv. without the nipping out etc, sort of just leave them to their own devices once they are in a 5" pot) but so far haven't managed to get a bush... last year it was down to the bush type, it seems it was a popular problem. I'm hoping this year I get more of a bush and less of a leggy cordon.

[sally wright]

Dear Myrkk,
to grow well tomatoes need at pots of at least 10-15 litres in size, 20 if you can get hold of containers that big. If you have grown them in soil inside the greenhouse for more that one season then there will be problems with the soil as you are not rotating the ground (ie growing something diofferent in between crops of tomatoes).
Regards Sally Wright.

[Primrose]

If you don't mind experimenting, I recommend the tumbling varieties. For the past two years, amongst other varieties I've grown Tumbling Yellow & have cropped so many tomatoes from them that they've been almost an embarrassment. I grow them both in the soil and in large patio containers, digging in a handful of chicken manure pellets into the compost and some water retaining crystals. Apart from some regular watering they don't need attention because they don't need staking up like the tall cordon varieties and of course you don't have to pinch the sideshoots out either because they go on to produce extra flowers & fruit.

[Myrkk]

Primrose, I love experimenting... so I shall definately try that.

Sally, that's an interesting point. Can I ask, at what stage do you put them into the big pots? Should you do it gradually to avoid "drowning" them in a huge pot, or will that cause problems with the trusses that are setting? Or, should I just put them into a big pot once the first trusses are showing and them leave them?

Thanks for all the help guys. Tomatoes are really something I want to do well.

[Primrose]

I plant my tumbling tomatoes outside in their final pots in early June by which time they're getting fairly pot bound in their smaller pots (and you might have to find bigger pots for them temporarily for a couple of weeks).. If necessary for a few days because of chilly nights I protect them with large individual bell-shaped cloches. If they're really getting potbound before that & you have some effective cloche protection you can plant them out earlier

[sally wright]

Dear Myrkk,
I would start with the seeds in a seed tray and wait until the seed leaves were at least one inch or 2-3cms long and then prick out into four inch (1ocms) rim diameter sized pots. This will take about three to four weeks. Give them another three - four weeks in these by which time they will be about 1 foot or 30cms tall. On planting bury the tomato plant up to the first pair of true leaves (or more if they are a bit leggy). I generally plan on sowing the seeds about 8 weeks before the final planting out/potting which I will be doing at the end of May.
Regards Sally Wright.

[cabbagehead]

I'm doing tomatoes from seed I saved last year. MY success rate is very poor. Germination is happening , but the plants are not growing much further than the first true leaf stage. I have tried not quite filling pots tothe top with compost so that as the plant grows, I can keep adding compost aroud the stem for better root formation. It seems not to work. Any ideas?

[Primrose]

It may be due to low light levels at the moment because of all the rain we're having (dark clouds and no sunshine) and lower temperature levels than tomatoes would normally like. I assume you've got them in the best place you can for these conditions. You'll probably find that if it gets warmer and sunnier they will start romping away. Mine are looking a bit "stuck" at the moment too.