Does weedkiller really kill twitch?

[Barry]

I am very interested in your experiences regarding weedkiller.

As part of the instructions for Roundup, it states that some stubborn weeds may require more than one application of weedkiller. Now, what does that exactly mean?

A systemic weedkiller, such as Roundup, is supposed to be sucked into the deepest depths of a weed, which is then completely erradicated. But, if several applications are required, what is happening?

For example, I followed the instructions for spraying out twitch (couch), but still haven't been able to kill the stuff.

In fact, I experimented with several different dilutions and applications and the d*mn stuff still survived the winter, even though the tops of the grass all died.

With twitch, weedkiller seems to BURN the tops, leaving the dreaded root systems untouched. By "several applications" does Monsanto mean that I now have to wait for the plant to regrow and then respray. Because there is a problem with doing that: by allowing the tops to regrow, the roots will keep being boosted, too. It is a vicious circle.

Has anybody out there in truth managed to spray out twich using Roundup? I'm beginning to have my doubts.

Almost all my 250 square metre plot has twitch embedded in it. Although I am partially resigned to handweeding it, the time required - one hour per square metre - is insane.

My fellow plot holders keep turning it in during digging, much to my horror and contrary to the advice I give them.

Also, has anybody succeeded in killer patches of twitch by using black sheeting? I suspect this might prove as difficult, since roots often spread beyond the actually head of the plant - to infinity AND BEYOND.

[Pa Snip]

Black sheeting over cooch (or couch if you prefer) is useless

[peter]

Roundup will kill it very effectively, BUT only if you apply it at the correct time of year.
Weeds need to be in active growth with sufficient green to apply the spray to.
I'm assuming from your comment about surviving over winter that you sprayed after September, or even later?
Once you have to mow regularly Couch will be susceptible to glyphosate.

Couch does not like it's roots disturbed, so plenty of digging and root removal needs to follow, it will whatever you do, apart fom kill everything for yards around, make its way back in from grass paths.

An aid to clearing dense grass with couch mixed in is to spray, wait untill it's dead, burn with a roofers torch, leave and wait for fresh growth to emerge and get to four inches, then respray and wait for death of the green.

[Barry]

Hi Peter,

I think I sprayed in August, when the twitch was as dense as dense could be.

I had thought I had killed it all, since everything above the surface was effectively dead, but when I began turning the land over in the winter, it was clear the roots were as happy as sand boys.

In which month would you personally begin spraying the stuff? Is April too early?

I have dug around a very large patch indeed, removing all the roots, but the centre is covered by a sheet of dense plastic 7m x 5m in area. Would you suggest I take the sheeting off and allow the twitch to "go green" on top and then spray it, or is my "isolation" tactic going to pay off, bearing in mind what his Pa Snippian said above?

I'm digging some, sheeting others and spraying what I can, but this is a nightmare plot.

[peter]

I wouldn't cover it, let it dry, rake up and dispose of the dead material, allow to sprout, then spray once it's about 4 inches of green.
If you can get hold of a decent flamer, roofers propane torch with the gas bottle in a metal wheelbarrow for safety, then burn off the surface once it's dead and dry. Wait for regrowth and repeat.

[Geoff]

I've not had to deal with much twitch but whatever you do don't mess about with recommended dilutions and application rates. If you use it too strong it will kill the top too quickly for it to spread to the roots properly.

[PLUMPUDDING]

If you use a torch or flame gun please be careful, I've had some spectacular accidents when using mine on the paths. A 20 ft conifer destroyed in 5 minutes, 10 ft of privet hedge, and my compost bin (not all at once). The common factors were very dry weather and a strong breeze!!!

[Marigold]

re covering.. not twitch but worked on nettles and reeds. When I had the polytunnel years ago it was erected on a neglected field. The gardening place who put it up told me not to disturb the soil but to cover with cardboard, compost etc. After two years all the roots were almost on the surface, seeking light, and pulled up so easily. Might that work? I would not be safe with a flame thrower and using it here would be illegal anyways.. We have just had our annual spate of illegal gorse burning.

[peter]

Of course the second precaution, besides making the gas bottle easily movable and semi protected from flame is to have a couple of buckets and/or watering cans filled with water and near to hand.

[KGAdmin]

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[Geoff]

I wonder if anybody has tried a method that breaks the normal rule of dealing with creeping weeds. If you thoroughly rotavate and break the roots into small pieces then let them sprout before applying weedkiller would it more effective because each bit of green is supported by much less root so more likely to be killed? Just a thought, no practical experience.

[Pa Snip]

Geoff

The theory is an interesting one, after all Twitch, Couch or Cooch (perm any one from three) does not like being moved around. Dangerous experiment to undertake though since even the smallest segment of root will grow again.

I have to stay with the age old recommendation of constant removal and as frequent digging as possible

[Barry]

Yes, Geoff, that is an interesting idea.

One of the plot holders is doing an interesting experiment. She is rotavating and using a flame burner on the soil afterwards, then rotavating again and burning. Some weeds are coming back, but not yet a carpet, as I would have expected.

Other people are turning soil over that is covered in twitch and exposing roots - they don't know they are doing this, but they don't follow my somewhat panicked advice over twitch and just keep digging. I've thought about this quite a lot. In theory, they are making life hell for themselves later on, but I wonder if that will be the case. If they hoe, the smaller pieces of twitch won't be as strong, so it might be a way of keeping it at bay.

Me, I keep on pulling the stuff out. Yet I don't think this is good for the run-of-the-mill allotmenteer, because you eventually go nuts. Indeed, while I should do more of this, I find endless excuses to do other things too. I won't give up, but some of the others with less passion could fell fall at the first hurdle. Twitch really breaks your heart

[Shallot Man]

Does it really mater whether the weed killer works or not. Seem to have read that our Masters in Brussels are going to bane it for us mere mortals.

[stormingnorman]

In my experience glyphosate works well. Its not cheap, and using it at the correct concentration is important to get the roots properly treated, it needs some patience and a good month to work - I would recommend not to disturb the ground for that time.

Couch, bind weed and brambles all recur in a weaker form every year, even after treatment, and need treating twice a year for two maybe three years to eradicate entirely. It worked on my allotment, but of course these things come back from adjacent patches eventually - but they are much easier to treat once they have been properly zapped.

My sister removes hers by hand each year, painstaking of course but that will also eventually get it controlled, but not erradicated.

Good luck!